Forum for Pigeon Fanciers
 
HomeHome  PortalPortal  CalendarCalendar  GalleryGallery  FAQFAQ  SearchSearch  UsergroupsUsergroups  RegisterRegister  Log in  Report a StrayReport a Stray  UK Pigeon SalesUK Pigeon Sales  Jack Barkel Website.Jack Barkel Website.  Friendslofts WebsiteFriendslofts Website  Velocity CalculatorVelocity Calculator  Portal 2Portal 2  ebayebay  
Latest topics
» GUTTED !!!!
by MISTY Today at 8:15 pm

» York Road & District Flying Club
by David Today at 4:32 pm

» Great Faith etc !!!.
by oldstrain Today at 2:59 pm

» Goodbye old club
by halcanada Today at 2:18 pm

» Weather today
by Daz Today at 1:24 pm

» Trainer from today
by Knackered Today at 12:02 am

» TIME FOR FINGERS OUT
by oldstrain Yesterday at 4:11 pm

» Rapido1988 Welcome....
by oldstrain Yesterday at 4:08 pm

» YB Back !!!
by David Yesterday at 8:32 am

Forum Syndicate
Pigeon World Syndicate Bird takes 81st Place in the 2017 Final Race, The Bird is Dia Evans Bloodlines and was Bred and supplied by Tumley Lofts Stud.
R.P.R.A Certificate.
Pigeon World Forum Syndicate take 81st Place in the 2017 R.P.R.A. Final, with a Pigeon Bred and Supplied by Tumley Lofts Stud.
Who is online?
In total there are 32 users online :: 4 Registered, 0 Hidden and 28 Guests :: 2 Bots

barnie, David, Lofty, MISTY

Most users ever online was 144 on Thu Apr 05, 2012 11:37 am
Bucktons 2017 Calendar
Pigeon World Forum, Fancier of the Year Trophy.
Top posting users this week
David
 
oldstrain
 
MISTY
 
Knackered
 
Daz
 
Lofty
 
halcanada
 
redrog
 
chuda
 
peel bros
 
Statistics
We have 1142 registered users
The newest registered user is rapido1988

Our users have posted a total of 169396 messages in 11192 subjects
Log in
Username:
Password:
Log in automatically: 
:: I forgot my password
Oldstrain/Darren`s Winner of winners. 2012.
From Fed Topper to Master Chef
The N.E.H.U race from Melton Mowbray 21/4/2012 was won by Peel bros of South Shields, they took 1st club 1st fed, also taking 2nd and 4th club and 15 of the 25 birds clocked in the club......well done Peel brothers.
John Gibbs young pied/grizzle winner.
Top posters
David
 
Don Webb
 
oldstrain
 
IANYOUNG
 
peel bros
 
Knackered
 
Gaz b
 
birdy2011
 
Rene A
 
Alex
 

Share | 
 

 Heat! what heat?

Go down 
Go to page : 1, 2  Next
AuthorMessage
Daz
Chipping
Chipping


Posts : 105
Join date : 2018-07-15

PostSubject: Heat! what heat?   Fri Aug 03, 2018 10:28 am

Spain in parts 48 C. that's 118 fara. etc. Who's sending. Indeed just who do you think are the fancier there racing this week - end?
I well remember when the temperature reach 70 and it was news on the TV and media!
Now here we are expecting our birds to fly in nigh 100 F!


Last edited by Daz on Fri Aug 03, 2018 10:37 am; edited 2 times in total
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Daz
Chipping
Chipping


Posts : 105
Join date : 2018-07-15

PostSubject: Re: Heat! what heat?   Fri Aug 03, 2018 10:28 am

by Gord Chalmers » Wed Jul 17, 2013 1:53 pm
A lot of old bird racing now appears to be over for the most part, or almost over, and fanciers are turning to training for the young bird series of races. At the moment, I have concerns about the welfare of racing birds, whether old or young, when I note the extremely hot conditions + very high levels of humidity (and the potential for the complicating factor of smog alerts) that are now occurring, especially in eastern Canada. Even in the usually dry west, there is currently a lot of standing water in fields coupled with water saturation of the soil as a result of continuous heavy rains and severe flooding problems, so the potential for the same combinations of very high heat (it's coming this week) and humidity to occur here is also very real.
Studies have shown that pigeons can fly from a distance of approximately 200 miles (320 km) in 4.25 hours while maintaining an average metabolic rate that is more than 17 times the resting level. The resulting heat production naturally raises their body temperature. It is a fact that under the extremely severe combined conditions of high environmental temperatures and high humidity, in training tosses and races, pigeons have a great deal of difficulty controlling their internal temperature. As a result, pigeons will normally stop flying when their core body temperature rises from an average resting value of about 104.5F (40.3C) to about 110F (43.3C) or more because of such conditions.
My point in raising this issue is that I feel very strongly that it is definitely inhumane to send birds racing (except possibly for shorter races that are liberated very early in the cooler morning) from the middle distance and longer races when they are held under these extremely severe conditions. I know, I know - the die-hards will argue that after all, these are merely birds, that nature will take care of them, that this is part of the natural selective process (it's not because in a natural setting, nature would curtail their normal activities under these conditions), that we have never held birds back in the past because of severe heat/humidity, and on and on with other indefensible protests. In my view the time is long past due for a critical look at this unreasonable aspect of the sport in Canada. It's time for individual fanciers, clubs, combines and yes, the CU too, to tackle this issue and to lay out standards of activity that are much more humane. (I note that workers in the terrible Lac Megantic tragedy now have to struggle in 50 C (122 F) heat and can only handle 15 minutes (max) of work at one time. We need to be as concerned for the welfare of our pigeons as we are for these workers. JMO. Gord.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Daz
Chipping
Chipping


Posts : 105
Join date : 2018-07-15

PostSubject: Re: Heat! what heat?   Fri Aug 03, 2018 10:29 am

Now getting back to heat and the birds flying. Yes I have no doubt in war years, even the Egyptians and romans if and when circumstances meant for it to happen - messages!


What do the 'Hot nations' do with their' pigeons regards the heat.
Also look at the Aussies and their' race days! Y/b birds raced only in Australia ! Check it out!

I, as you know, like a very high majority whom sadly won't voice their opinion if the 'Ear Ticklers' are about would actually welcome a later start. 2nd week in May or later.
Now June surely must be the time for short races.. to a little of middle races. This could serve as two purposes. Later and better breeding for starter. Light training then better start to the Inland races. The pigeons pencilled in for the longer and harder races could have the odd shorter races to freshen or condition them etc. End of July young birds could start racing into September. The old bird distance raced at that time would be going into middle distances and onto the longer and harder races in August.
Also many hens used for widowerhood could be raced in 2-5 different systems as the owner wants.
Indeed this would also help the birds in their racing as they could be rotated with the sexes. Smaller but better class of pigeons would ensue. Smaller teams and fewer losses. Strains and stresses of the minimised with better conditioned pigeons.

Will it ever happen?
Off course not. people hate change and get comfortable with their' habits. No two ways about that!

Yet WE love our pigeons … Mostly I believe that. We feed and water and care for them 365 days a years. Spend a lot of time, money and many others things take a back seat as we put our love of the pigeon before most else!

Now that last sentence says a lot. A lot of things and much truth.
Also on the outside looking in it says a lot in as much that we contradict our self's. Indeed a good case can easily be made that it is a fallacy, or best ONLY a half truth put forward.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
MISTY
Hatchling
Hatchling


Posts : 596
Join date : 2018-01-28
Age : 83
Location : SCARBOROUGH

PostSubject: Re: Heat! what heat?   Fri Aug 03, 2018 8:02 pm

Daz
In our country you are knocking your head against a brick wall attempting to make any changes.

I have advocated starting racing later in the year for the past 40 years, it would have many advantages for both pigeon and fancier alike.

Also later liberastions for the shorter races.

Bred at the right time youngsters need not go on the darkness system and there is no readon not to have races well into September and even November, the weather is more suitable regarding transportation and the prospect of the pigeons suffering from dehydration etc; is reduced.

Extreem cold does not adversely affect a pigeon as does over heating, in nature all animals have to forage afar for their food in Winter in the Summer it is local to feed the young etc;

I am afraid the sport has many things back to front but with the Old Brigade and their idiot supporters, mostly either in the commercial field or have been given a couple of young ones to grease their palms, matters will not change until the penny drops and it may be too late.

I have exposed the present set up as not fit for purpose over many years and never been challenged by them which should to any normal person say enpugh to change matters,

APATHY< APATHY.


Regards.




Back to top Go down
View user profile http://albertrosbottom35@outlook.com Online
Knackered
Oldbird
Oldbird
avatar

Posts : 7600
Join date : 2013-03-11

PostSubject: Re: Heat! what heat?   Sat Aug 04, 2018 12:09 am

Daz wrote:
Now getting back to heat and the birds flying. Yes I have no doubt in war years, even the Egyptians and romans if and when circumstances  meant for it to happen - messages!


What do the 'Hot nations' do with their' pigeons regards the heat.
Also look at the Aussies and their' race days! Y/b birds raced only in Australia ! Check it out!

I, as you know, like a very high majority whom sadly won't voice their opinion if the 'Ear Ticklers' are about would actually welcome a later start. 2nd week in May or later.
Now June surely must be the time for short races.. to a little of middle races. This could serve as two purposes. Later and better breeding for starter. Light training then better start to the Inland races. The pigeons pencilled in for the longer and harder races could have the odd shorter races to freshen or condition them etc. End of July young birds could start racing into September. The old bird distance raced at that time would be going into middle distances and onto the longer and harder races in August.
Also many hens used for widowerhood could be raced in 2-5 different systems as the owner wants.
Indeed this would also help the birds in their racing as they could be rotated with the sexes. Smaller but better class of pigeons would ensue. Smaller teams and fewer losses. Strains and stresses of the minimised with better conditioned pigeons.

Will it ever happen?
Off course not. people hate change and get comfortable with their' habits. No two ways about that!

Yet WE love our pigeons … Mostly I believe that. We feed and water and care for them 365 days a years. Spend a lot of time, money and many others things take a back seat as we put our love of the pigeon before most else!

Now that last sentence says a lot. A lot of things and much truth.
Also on the outside looking in it says a lot in as much that we contradict our self's. Indeed a good case can easily be made that it is a fallacy, or best ONLY a half truth put forward.
Daz Wink Wink I know a wee bit, about Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Aussie conditions in hot weather etc Smile Smile & what pigeons could achieve 30/40 odd years ago there bounce bounce is impossible today to achieve as such on average from distance type races. Climate change sceptics, may argue its just a circle thing that is occurring & if one has patiens Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes things will get back to normal type of thing, but for me that is pure waffle type talk which has no use today with how things are from my perspective in our sport. Change ones season, with when you start maybe or have the flexibility to race on a chosen day within a 7 day calendar circle are 2 ways that may help the issue from my perspective. To deny things are OK thou by those in charge & will be OK I would suggest is just like putting ones head in a bucket of sand & saying everything will be OK & just trust me & have faith Crying or Very sad Crying or Very sad Crying or Very sad as I have the smarts to know best etc Wink Wink is just pure garbage  Smile  Smile to some degree, unfortunately from this old fella's point of view  Wink  Wink. cheers
Back to top Go down
View user profile
halcanada
Youngbird
Youngbird
avatar

Posts : 3118
Join date : 2014-03-11
Age : 78
Location : Southern Ontario. Canada.

PostSubject: Re: Heat! what heat?   Sat Aug 04, 2018 1:52 am

Knackered. In my opinion many pigeons are not as tough as years ago. Due to many circumstances.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
MISTY
Hatchling
Hatchling


Posts : 596
Join date : 2018-01-28
Age : 83
Location : SCARBOROUGH

PostSubject: Re: Heat! what heat?   Sat Aug 04, 2018 9:54 am

Hal,
You are right of course, both the health and longevity of performance have been bred out of present day pigeons, mainly through commercialism and the desire for profit by any means.

Hundreds if not thousands of pigeons that the owners are fully aware are rubbish but having paid a ransom for them they must get back their outlay, so over a period of time you get more and more useless and unhealthy pigeons needing constant medication.

II 1970 I said that we should not go continental and introduce all their methods etc; because we would also introduce all their problems.

In my opinion, if we had concentrated on our own pigeons in our own methods it would be the world wanting to buy all our pigeons, which would not have needed all the medication etc; to keep them alive.

But you cannot expect the money mad to consider anything other than how to make a fast buck.

Regards.


Back to top Go down
View user profile http://albertrosbottom35@outlook.com Online
Daz
Chipping
Chipping


Posts : 105
Join date : 2018-07-15

PostSubject: Re: Heat! what heat?   Sat Aug 04, 2018 11:44 am

Good replies above.
In the U.S.U they re- introduce the Mountain lion... or rather bred and re - located them. It was a big thing in reality. So the place them in those places etc.
A few years own the line they saw that the lions weren' tas good as they should and hoped them to have been.
The saw deformities in the tails, shorter and slightly twisted etc.
The test showed that they were suffering from incest breeding! They wonder how this could be as nature dictates that this is seldom possible. After some time they hit the nail on the head. There was a motorway / were motorways surrounding their regions. So they built tunnels under these. Relocated the males and place un - related ones. this after a time solved the problem.
Dogs for instance- and pedigrees tend to have flaws now. Alsatians started to lose their back side, droop and curved downwards. The list is endless.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
David
Oldbird
Oldbird
avatar

Posts : 32276
Join date : 2009-03-18
Location : Leeds

PostSubject: Re: Heat! what heat?   Sat Aug 04, 2018 12:29 pm

yes daz, I agree with your point about dogs, it seems they are breeding for the show ring, rather than what the breed was originally bred to do....its all about looks rather than practicality .

and like most things all about the £££££££
Back to top Go down
View user profile Online
Daz
Chipping
Chipping


Posts : 105
Join date : 2018-07-15

PostSubject: Re: Heat! what heat?   Sat Aug 04, 2018 2:05 pm

Also their' immune system, like our pigeons, have been shot to pieces Dave.
It is illegal, with good reason and proven that incest is against the law. Likewise near relatives... yet some the blood in sheer ignorance and spout that '''e done every thing I can / could for better results'! Eh!
Back to top Go down
View user profile
David
Oldbird
Oldbird
avatar

Posts : 32276
Join date : 2009-03-18
Location : Leeds

PostSubject: Re: Heat! what heat?   Sat Aug 04, 2018 2:31 pm

this is why Pakistani / muslims tend to have a high rate of deformities , they very often marry cousins, which perpetuates down the line......cousin to cousin over a few generations produce children who cannot lead a normal life and need constant attention, therefore putting extra strain on the nhs and other services.
Back to top Go down
View user profile Online
Daz
Chipping
Chipping


Posts : 105
Join date : 2018-07-15

PostSubject: Re: Heat! what heat?   Sun Aug 05, 2018 8:58 am

Likewise on our Pigeons David
Back to top Go down
View user profile
David
Oldbird
Oldbird
avatar

Posts : 32276
Join date : 2009-03-18
Location : Leeds

PostSubject: Re: Heat! what heat?   Tue Aug 07, 2018 8:54 am

Daz wrote:
Likewise on our Pigeons David

I don't know if anyone remembers a yb of mine found dead in the street outside my house a few weeks ago, I presumed it had hit wires, although there was no sign of injury....it just happened to be a brother to sister pairing, not intended, but it just happened so I kept the yb....wondering if there was some in breeding problem, that's why it "dropped dead" maybe ?
Back to top Go down
View user profile Online
Knackered
Oldbird
Oldbird
avatar

Posts : 7600
Join date : 2013-03-11

PostSubject: Re: Heat! what heat?   Tue Aug 07, 2018 8:58 am

David wrote:
Daz wrote:
Likewise on our Pigeons David

I don't know if anyone remembers a yb of mine found dead in the street outside my house a few weeks ago, I presumed it had hit wires, although there was no sign of injury....it just happened to be a brother to sister pairing, not intended, but it just happened so I kept the yb....wondering if there was some in breeding problem, that's why it "dropped dead" maybe ?
Maybe Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes maybe not etc Smile Smile Life's to short thou David bounce bounce to be worrying either way I would suggest. cheers
*****
Back to top Go down
View user profile
MISTY
Hatchling
Hatchling


Posts : 596
Join date : 2018-01-28
Age : 83
Location : SCARBOROUGH

PostSubject: Re: Heat! what heat?   Tue Aug 07, 2018 9:01 am

Doubt very much if inbreeding had anything to do with it, many fanciers have based their entire life in the sport by close in breeding.

There is no doubt it does have a long term detrimental effect by enhancing any problems that existed at the start.

But if it is a one off and there is nothing to actually go by?????.

Regards.
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://albertrosbottom35@outlook.com Online
David
Oldbird
Oldbird
avatar

Posts : 32276
Join date : 2009-03-18
Location : Leeds

PostSubject: Re: Heat! what heat?   Tue Aug 07, 2018 9:03 am

yes your right knackered, but ive also been concerned about a husband and wife neighbours of mine, im sure they are brother and sister, my mrs says I`m a nutcase, but I`m convinced they are. Suspect Suspect scratch study
Back to top Go down
View user profile Online
Knackered
Oldbird
Oldbird
avatar

Posts : 7600
Join date : 2013-03-11

PostSubject: Re: Heat! what heat?   Tue Aug 07, 2018 9:13 am

David wrote:
yes your right knackered, but ive also been concerned about a husband and wife neighbours of mine, im sure they are brother and sister, my mrs says I`m a nutcase, but I`m convinced they are. Suspect Suspect scratch study
lol! lol! lol! Be brave bounce bounce be up front with them David etc lol! lol! lol! & just ask them as such. Could maybe Wink Wink make a life time friend there  Smile  Smile maybe. cheers
Back to top Go down
View user profile
MISTY
Hatchling
Hatchling


Posts : 596
Join date : 2018-01-28
Age : 83
Location : SCARBOROUGH

PostSubject: Re: Heat! what heat?   Tue Aug 07, 2018 9:24 am

David,
You can worry about little things when the actual important things that affect everyone are not addressed.

If you are worried about brother and sister, just at an opportune moment say to the guy, if you know the ladies name, how is your sister ??? .


His reaction will either solve your problem or get you a black eye.

Regards.
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://albertrosbottom35@outlook.com Online
Knackered
Oldbird
Oldbird
avatar

Posts : 7600
Join date : 2013-03-11

PostSubject: Re: Heat! what heat?   Tue Aug 07, 2018 9:26 am

MISTY wrote:
David,
       You can worry about little things when the actual important things that affect everyone are not addressed.

      If you are worried about brother and sister, just at an opportune moment say to the guy, if you know the ladies name, how is your sister ??? .


     His reaction will either solve your problem or get you a black eye.

Regards.
lol! lol! lol! Smile Smile. cheers
Back to top Go down
View user profile
David
Oldbird
Oldbird
avatar

Posts : 32276
Join date : 2009-03-18
Location : Leeds

PostSubject: Re: Heat! what heat?   Tue Aug 07, 2018 9:35 am

MISTY wrote:
David,
       You can worry about little things when the actual important things that affect everyone are not addressed.

      If you are worried about brother and sister, just at an opportune moment say to the guy, if you know the ladies name, how is your sister ??? .


     His reaction will either solve your problem or get you a black eye.

Regards.


funny you should say that misty, I did just happen to mention it to one of his next door neighbours, who had been at loggerheads with them, he did mention it during a confrontation, but I don't know if it went down well...........I know they still hold hands when walking up the street, so it doesn't seem to have bothered them at all.   Razz  Razz  Razz  cheers

p.s. I know they both have the same second name, so that leads me to believe they must be brother and sister, no other explanation for it eh ...... scratch study
Back to top Go down
View user profile Online
Daz
Chipping
Chipping


Posts : 105
Join date : 2018-07-15

PostSubject: Re: Heat! what heat?   Tue Aug 07, 2018 10:30 am

I also doubt that inbreeding had any thing to do with it.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Daz
Chipping
Chipping


Posts : 105
Join date : 2018-07-15

PostSubject: Re: Heat! what heat?   Tue Aug 07, 2018 10:35 am

Stu had a good pigeon from a NRCC race. Came back looking marvellous. Prepared it for the Lerwick Race. feed and rest etc.

Sent on the Wednesday - Thursday.
Said it was in absolute mint condition and fancied it to do well.
It came back in a box dead.
It ha died in the transporter pannier.
So he took it for tests as to why it had died. the report came back 'Canker'! I wasn't at all surprised.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
MISTY
Hatchling
Hatchling


Posts : 596
Join date : 2018-01-28
Age : 83
Location : SCARBOROUGH

PostSubject: Re: Heat! what heat?   Thu Aug 09, 2018 9:10 am

Can remember canker being a problem 70 0dd years ago have never had a problem with it myself, other than a pair I was given, which I culled.

Having had a recent look at the problem, It is apparent that if a raptor eats a pigeon suffering from canker it will also get the problem and die. ????????.


Regards.
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://albertrosbottom35@outlook.com Online
Daz
Chipping
Chipping


Posts : 105
Join date : 2018-07-15

PostSubject: Re: Heat! what heat?   Thu Aug 09, 2018 12:57 pm

John Bellerby had a pigeon doing well, all of a sudden went down hill fast. frank Tasker told him it was a deep rooted canker, to treat full strength Baytril with a full strength Canker … different from any he had used before if possible.
Three weeks later it won well in the NRCC. Ron Davis - who writes for the R.P and B.H.W. told a good friend from Clackman club the same. Other well known fanciers have now accepted that many Illnesses are wrongly diagnosed, it being a strong rooted canker. Normal treatment is useless. There are 33 or more cankers, and they very quickly get immune from treatment. So after twice change the brand.
Canker is a yeast, like the Thrush one gets, especially the ladies. So Naystating is also very good.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
David
Oldbird
Oldbird
avatar

Posts : 32276
Join date : 2009-03-18
Location : Leeds

PostSubject: Re: Heat! what heat?   Thu Aug 09, 2018 1:41 pm

we used to rub a match onto the canker in the mouth years ago, do idea if it worked, but there wasn't all these products about then if it remember rightly Suspect scratch
Back to top Go down
View user profile Online
Sponsored content




PostSubject: Re: Heat! what heat?   

Back to top Go down
 
Heat! what heat?
Back to top 
Page 1 of 2Go to page : 1, 2  Next

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
Racing Pigeons,Show & Fancy Pigeons :: General Pigeon News :: Race Results-
Jump to: