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Forum Syndicate 2019
Pigeon World Forum Syndicate Bird takes 44th Place, in the 2019 RPRA One Loft Final.The Bird is Frans Zwol Bloodline, Bred and supplied by Darren Palmer (Oldstrain)
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Pigeon World Forum Syndicate also takes 100th Place, in the 2019 RPRA One Loft Final. The Bird is Frans Zwol Bloodline, Bred and supplied by Darren Palmer (Oldstrain) Thoughts of Reasoning 20497337-174028
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Pigeon World Syndicate Bird takes 81st Place in the 2017 Final Race, The Bird is Dia Evans Bloodlines and was Bred and supplied by Tumley Lofts Stud.
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 Thoughts of Reasoning

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PostSubject: Thoughts of Reasoning   Thoughts of Reasoning EmptySat Jan 26, 2019 5:46 pm

The first great cause

Now the reason is, that every thing evolves, for nothing ever stands still. It either deteriorates or improves ….?

Hence the argument for an 'Chain of Events'.
If there is no first cause, then the universe is like a great chain with many links; each link is held up by the link above it, but the whole chain is held up by nothing. How so?

Now the whole universe is a vast, interlocking chain of things that come into existence. Each of these things must therefore have a cause.
Nothing just is, without a reason why it is. Everything that is has some adequate or sufficient reason why it is.
Philosophers call this the Principle of Sufficient Reason. We use it every day, in common sense and in science as well as in philosophy and theology.
Why must there be a first cause? Because if there isn't, then the whole universe is unexplained, and we have violated our Principle of Sufficient Reason for everything. If there is no first cause, each particular thing in the universe is explained in the short run, or proximately, by some other thing, but nothing is explained in the long run, or ultimately, and the universe as a whole is not explained. Everyone and everything says in turn, "Don't look to me for the final explanation. I'm just an instrument. Something else caused me." If that's all there is, then we have an endless passing of the buck. God is the one who says, "The buck stops here."
Every being that exists either exists by itself, by its own essence or nature, or it does not exist by itself. If it exists by its own essence, then it exists necessarily and eternally, and explains itself. It cannot not exist, as a triangle cannot not have three sides. If, on the other hand, a being exists but not by its own essence, then it needs a cause, a reason outside itself for its existence.
If there is no independent being, then the whole chain of dependent beings is dependent on nothing and hence could not exist.
 Some scientists say 'Only an idiot can be an atheist. We must admit that there exists an incomprehensible power or force with limitless foresight and knowledge that started the whole universe going in the first place'.
If it's there, it's there because...
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PostSubject: Re: Thoughts of Reasoning   Thoughts of Reasoning EmptySat Jan 26, 2019 7:14 pm

Daz wrote:
The first great cause

Now the reason is, that every thing evolves, for nothing ever stands still. It either deteriorates or improves ….?

Hence the argument for an 'Chain of Events'.
If there is no first cause, then the universe is like a great chain with many links; each link is held up by the link above it, but the whole chain is held up by nothing. How so?

Now the whole universe is a vast, interlocking chain of things that come into existence. Each of these things must therefore have a cause.
Nothing just is, without a reason why it is. Everything that is has some adequate or sufficient reason why it is.
Philosophers call this the Principle of Sufficient Reason. We use it every day, in common sense and in science as well as in philosophy and theology.
Why must there be a first cause? Because if there isn't, then the whole universe is unexplained, and we have violated our Principle of Sufficient Reason for everything. If there is no first cause, each particular thing in the universe is explained in the short run, or proximately, by some other thing, but nothing is explained in the long run, or ultimately, and the universe as a whole is not explained. Everyone and everything says in turn, "Don't look to me for the final explanation. I'm just an instrument. Something else caused me." If that's all there is, then we have an endless passing of the buck. God is the one who says, "The buck stops here."
Every being that exists either exists by itself, by its own essence or nature, or it does not exist by itself. If it exists by its own essence, then it exists necessarily and eternally, and explains itself. It cannot not exist, as a triangle cannot not have three sides. If, on the other hand, a being exists but not by its own essence, then it needs a cause, a reason outside itself for its existence.
If there is no independent being, then the whole chain of dependent beings is dependent on nothing and hence could not exist.
 Some scientists say 'Only an idiot can be an atheist. We must admit that there exists an incomprehensible power or force with limitless foresight and knowledge that started the whole universe going in the first place'.
If it's there, it's there because...
Boy oh boy Wink Wink Daz Smile Smile bit on the heavy side I suggest  lol!  lol!  lol! here maybe, to understand as such. Think I will just stick with David Attenbourger etc. Talks the talk Smile Smile that this old fella understands type of thing Smile Smile. cheers
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PostSubject: Re: Thoughts of Reasoning   Thoughts of Reasoning EmptySat Jan 26, 2019 7:38 pm

Anyone who believes that the universe was not created must have a very limited intelligence.

You could put a car in front of them and nothing on earth would convince them that it had come about by chance.

It is apparent that there has been numerous different ages with regard to the earth and all that it holds.

The creator having experimented until deciding on his final decision for it's existance and purpose just as humans do the same.

If left alone with no interferance all things would stay as they were created, like breed like and the system created would sustain every living thing in the manner intended.

The sea is a magnificent example, it provides 75% of the worlds oxygen and the other by plants, the interdependancies could not have evolved they must all have been created at the same time.

I used to feel for the fact that animals have to eat other animals etc; to live, and then on consideration, and reflection, how on else could the echo system work?.


When the creator decided on creating mankind he gave him full control of the earth, no other previous animal had, had, the same.


You can look up numerous theories written by others but none make any sense relative to the facts available.



The gene theories are rubbish, everything has genes by which THEIR species are determied and obviously some can be close to others, like the banana being relatievely close to ours etc;

The fact as to the present is, all the signs indicate ARMAGEDDON is on the horisen and that is a FACT.


Regards.




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PostSubject: Re: Thoughts of Reasoning   Thoughts of Reasoning EmptySat Jan 26, 2019 7:46 pm

MISTY wrote:
Anyone who believes that the universe was not created must have a very limited intelligence.

You could put a car in front of them and nothing on earth would convince them that it had come about by chance.

It is apparent that there has been numerous different ages with regard to the earth and all that it holds.

The creator having experimented until deciding on his final decision for it's existance and purpose just as humans do the same.

If left alone with no interferance all things would stay as they were created, like breed like and the system created would sustain every living thing in the manner intended.

The sea is a magnificent example, it provides 75% of the worlds oxygen and the other by plants, the interdependancies could not have evolved they must all have been created at the same time.

I used to feel for the fact that animals have to eat other animals etc; to live, and then on consideration, and reflection, how on else could the echo system work?.


When the creator decided on creating mankind he gave him full control of the earth, no other previous animal had, had, the same.


You can look up numerous theories written by others but none make any sense relative to the facts available.



The gene theories are rubbish, everything has genes by which THEIR species are determied and obviously some can be close to others, like the banana being relatievely close to ours etc;

The fact as to the present is, all the signs indicate ARMAGEDDON is on the horisen and that is a FACT.


Regards.




As I said Misty Wink Wink Boy oh boy as such lol! lol! lol! bit heavy for me I'm affraid Smile Smile especially bounce bounce when the roosters haven't even started crowing down here yet etc Smile Smile. cheers
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PostSubject: Re: Thoughts of Reasoning   Thoughts of Reasoning EmptySat Jan 26, 2019 9:21 pm

mmmmm heavy stuff lads and interesting points of view of which I feel the same to a certain extent ,the worlds not turning very well at the moment and a few more natural and man made disasters could see the tipping point
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PostSubject: Re: Thoughts of Reasoning   Thoughts of Reasoning EmptySat Jan 26, 2019 10:26 pm

condensed into 5 words............"I think, therefore I am"

work that one out Razz Razz Razz study lol!
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PostSubject: Re: Thoughts of Reasoning   Thoughts of Reasoning EmptySat Jan 26, 2019 10:35 pm

Simplicity is the ULTIMATE'

Regards.
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PostSubject: Re: Thoughts of Reasoning   Thoughts of Reasoning EmptySun Jan 27, 2019 12:45 pm

David wrote:
condensed into 5 words............"I think, therefore I am"

work that one out Razz Razz Razz study lol!
Exactly. 100%

Mind, how and why springs to mind eh!
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PostSubject: Re: Thoughts of Reasoning   Thoughts of Reasoning EmptySun Jan 27, 2019 1:02 pm

Most of us, if not all, have pondered thoughts beyond our capabilities and imagination.
I, for instance, like most of you (Before we give or gave up) Where does the universe end. What I
is beyond! … Nothing of course, Shocked But there must be some thing! but it can't just end, Can it?. A barb wire fence, another green field, A massive hole... what's the other side... etc. etc
Now we believe that there are at least 2 billion universes! Billions of stars. One large sun is measured like this. If you take a orange pip (Earth) and put a conker( The sun) 7 inches and that is relevant regards the size and distance ... where and what distance of size would be where you would put VY Canis Majoris, the biggest type of star known as a red hyper giant. It is 4,892 light years from Earth and has a circumference of 5.46billion miles-around 2,000 times that of our sun. It would take a passenger jet 1,100 years to fly round it once.
The answer in size would be 2 and a half miles!
Obviously there are quite conceivably much larger stars etc.

then one wonders what keeps them apart? Gravity! Now if the earth slowed down just a second in its spinning the Milky way would collapse and every thing would crash.

Now as we know the Stars burn energy etc. So hence they change in size and of course gravity pull / power.
Just what and how are they constantly altered so all at all times - of changing size - do they stop from crashing?

Is it a little green Martian nipping around and whipping them like a top lol.
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PostSubject: Re: Thoughts of Reasoning   Thoughts of Reasoning EmptySun Jan 27, 2019 4:37 pm

I like to ask those in the Big Bang Theory brigade, what went BANG? and where did it come from, still awaiting an answer.

Regards.


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PostSubject: Re: Thoughts of Reasoning   Thoughts of Reasoning EmptySun Jan 27, 2019 6:50 pm

MISTY wrote:
I like to ask those in the Big Bang Theory brigade, what went BANG? and where did it come from, still awaiting an answer.

Regards.


Don't quite know about the Bang, bang theory as such Misty Wink Wink But bounce bounce Go up country here on a bright night & marvel at all the universe above with all the stars in there glory as such there  Wink  Wink & I do question to a degree, how one man could have just created such a magic glorious type event etc  Smile  Smile . cheers
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PostSubject: Re: Thoughts of Reasoning   Thoughts of Reasoning EmptySun Jan 27, 2019 7:48 pm

Have sat at night and and watched the stars , even as a youngster and thought about all the other things in nature and decided however things materialized in such a manner it could not in my opinion be by chance.


So, Knackered, I looked for the possible answer and as far as I am concerned, found it.


Regards.


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PostSubject: Re: Thoughts of Reasoning   Thoughts of Reasoning EmptyMon Jan 28, 2019 12:05 pm

I don't take much notice of experts/government telling me what I should think, or how I should run my life........many of these things are just mens theories, or how they see the world, a lot our our history is a lie, and joe public take it as truth, its all they have every known, brain washing from the age of 5 when they go to school......it begins then Suspect Suspect study study
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PostSubject: Re: Thoughts of Reasoning   Thoughts of Reasoning EmptyMon Jan 28, 2019 1:16 pm

wish you'd stop with the armegeddon thing, don't know if I should get season ticket again or what???? Rolling Eyes Sad Razz
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PostSubject: Re: Thoughts of Reasoning   Thoughts of Reasoning EmptyMon Jan 28, 2019 4:30 pm

Just get one for half the season to be on the safe side.

Regards.
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PostSubject: Re: Thoughts of Reasoning   Thoughts of Reasoning EmptyMon Jan 28, 2019 8:22 pm

MISTY wrote:
Just get one for half the season to be on the safe side.

Regards.
lol! lol! lol! Not good enough Wink Wink I'm affraid Misty Smile Smile I still would require a pensioner discount etc bounce bounce maybe lol! lol! lol! if I'm to continue on here as such  Wink  Wink. cheers
*****
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PostSubject: Re: Thoughts of Reasoning   Thoughts of Reasoning EmptyMon Jan 28, 2019 10:09 pm

redrog wrote:
wish you'd stop with the armegeddon thing, don't know if I should get season ticket again or what???? Rolling Eyes Sad Razz
Smile Smile Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Bit like Wink Wink maybe. Songs of praise of a Sunday Rog on TV etc bounce bounce enjoyable for 30/60 minutes Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes But bounce bounce if it's in your face 24/7  Crying or Very sad  Crying or Very sad  Crying or Very sad in a big way, it can be a wee bit hard to take at times I suggest Smile Smile. Now Smile Smile just got my water bill as such presented to me. Happy, happy happy Smile Smile I'm, as it's only 250 odd dollars for the quarter Wink Wink.  
*****
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PostSubject: Re: Thoughts of Reasoning   Thoughts of Reasoning EmptyMon Jan 28, 2019 10:21 pm

Swap you my electric bill for your water bill, Knackered.

Exchanges between fanciers can be benificial ?????.


Regards.
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PostSubject: Re: Thoughts of Reasoning   Thoughts of Reasoning EmptyMon Jan 28, 2019 10:41 pm

MISTY wrote:
Swap you my electric bill for your water bill, Knackered.

Exchanges between fanciers can be benificial ?????.


Regards.
lol! lol! lol! Maybe Wink Wink maybe not Misty etc Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes my power bill runs around 500 odd dollars a quarter here & Crying or Very sad Crying or Very sad Crying or Very sad going up, up up as such unfortunately because of the clowns running the system up the top end of town here. Also Smile Smile maybe something to consider at your end, the other day here bounce bounce when we had 45 degree type temperatures, 200,000 odd local people had their power cut off for hours because the power grid just couldn't supply the power that was required on the day for the peasant types & local yocals Wink Wink. cheers
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PostSubject: Re: Thoughts of Reasoning   Thoughts of Reasoning EmptyMon Jan 28, 2019 10:55 pm

My electric bill is around £1200 a year, I pay monthly by direct debit, but the gas is only used for cooking and is about £150 year.

I only offered to exchange to give you the good feeling factor, helping a poor old fancier out.


But will understand if you do not want to take up the offer.


I was considering exchanging the Gas bill, but not for very long.


Regards.
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PostSubject: Re: Thoughts of Reasoning   Thoughts of Reasoning EmptyMon Jan 28, 2019 11:08 pm

MISTY wrote:
My electric bill is around £1200 a year, I pay monthly by direct debit, but the gas is only used for cooking and is about £150 year.

I only offered to exchange to give you the good feeling factor, helping a poor old fancier out.


But will understand if you do not want to take up the offer.


I was considering exchanging the Gas bill, but not for very long.
 

Regards.
I appreciate your kind offer/thought there above Wink Wink But lol! lol! lol! best I stick with the Devil I know here Misty Smile Smile I suggest, than the one I don't quite know type of thing. cheers
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PostSubject: Re: Thoughts of Reasoning   Thoughts of Reasoning EmptyMon Jan 28, 2019 11:12 pm

I think you are a little IMP, Knackered, of the OLD SCHOOL, not many of us left.

Regards.
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PostSubject: Re: Thoughts of Reasoning   Thoughts of Reasoning EmptyMon Jan 28, 2019 11:16 pm

AND SO TO BED, always stay always stay signed in find it easier as I am not fully conversant with this implement it has a mind of it's own, sweet dreams.

Regards.
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PostSubject: Re: Thoughts of Reasoning   Thoughts of Reasoning EmptyTue Jan 29, 2019 2:21 am

Very cold last night. Some frozen pipes. Hydro (electric heat) I use mostly. Propane heat other times. Hydro is cheaper in the long run. 350 Canadian dollars a month right now. Temp has gone up to plus 4 C now. 9 pm. Wll drop to minus 30 C for a few days then get back to more normal minus 5 or so. Put off weaning until weekend and temps warm up some. Financial aspect of racing pigeons. Club and Fed fees 100 bucks. Shipping is for the old bird series about $250. Plus per bird. Young birds About 400 dollars 40 limit. Plus payby bird entered. Includes trailer fees and other stuff. It is not cheap!!! To me one loft races are looking better. However, one must test the birds in club/combine racing before commiting. Usually a $1200 dollar fee for one lofters. 3 or 4 birds. Goal this year is to fly club/combine and really cull hard. No peds or expensive pigeons here. Best to best hope for the best. Just hope the management is smart enough to "read" the birds.
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PostSubject: Re: Thoughts of Reasoning   Thoughts of Reasoning EmptyTue Jan 29, 2019 9:05 am

MISTY wrote:
My electric bill is around £1200 a year, I pay monthly by direct debit, but the gas is only used for cooking and is about £150 year.

I only offered to exchange to give you the good feeling factor, helping a poor old fancier out.


But will understand if you do not want to take up the offer.


I was considering exchanging the Gas bill, but not for very long.
 

Regards.
Please, please please Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes don't ever mention the gas word to us local yocals down here etc Misty Smile Smile. We have some of the biggest gas fields on the planet here & we pay some of the highest prices on the planet for our gas bounce bounce thanks to the clowns running the show at the top end of town here. Billions going overseas Crying or Very sad Crying or Very sad Crying or Very sad but for the local mob, carn't even get enough gas to switch on the stove for tea Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes at times. cheers
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