Eye Sign in breeding pigeons

only confuse yourself if you think too much...............

looking at the first lot of eyes if i was picking any of them out i would pick .
the 1st one on the right , 2nd on the left , and the last one on the left , there all things i look for in pigeons
i don,t study eyes but to me there good strong eyes 2 of them are what we call pearl eyes they seem to be good all round racers .

out of the eyes on the first page i would choose the 5th eye on the right and the 5th eye on the left.

rainbow wrote:

hi is it kev? i tried to understand this eyesign about 30-40 years ago it was just the one circle around the pupil now they say there are 5 circles +a mountain range is it possible to take one of your eyes and explain what this all means cheers george

Hi George, as David says on the site where my pictures are there is a link to very easy to understand Eyesign experts site his name is Myron Kulik.

If you are unsure of anything if you send Myron an email he will be only to happy to help you to understand what you are looking for in a breeders Eye.

I am new to eye sign myself but it is very interesting and I believe there is something to it.

Myron has been assessing my photos and he picked out my 2 best racers from around 20 pictures I sent him, he didnt know their results and he told me they have excellent breeding Qualities in their eyes.

As from tomorrow Myron will be telling me which to pair to which and why.

When I have the relevant info I will of course post it on the site. If you have any birds that you can take a good picture of, (its not too hard with 2 people on a sunny day) not a problem here in Portugal but a light bulb can be used instead of sun.

Put the macro setting on the camera and get as close as you can to the eye to stay in focus around 5 cm to 7 cm is close enough, the left eye was the ones I did so the light needs to come into the birds eye from behind the camera from the left side. Then you dont block it out.

Take 5 or 6 or more shots of the eye, then when editing the pics you just crop the eye out of the sharpest of your images and save the file.

Then if you send the pics to Myron via email he will give you an assessment of the eyeball he loves looking at pigeons eyes, lol.

Sorry to all the guys who think eyesign is rubbish but I think it is a fun and good talking point to get through the long winter, lol.

In any case it has at least as much credibility as selecting birds by physical shapes. Birds win in all shapes and sizes but super breeders have super eyes.

Yours in sport Kev

http://algarvepigeonracing.webs.com/apps/links/

thanks David i 've just had a look and find it very boring if any one would like 2 of the dvds they can have them for free i will keep the Irish one for the lofts not eye sign dvds are titled EYE SIGN THE ULTIMATE SELECTION

i kev, i used to study eyesign years ago but to be honest in my opinion it isnt proven enough to be of any relevance to racing, altho i think it is of benefit to breeding in some cases.........i read in the weeky pigeon mags where eyesign experts give their opinion of certain eyes and it seems they already know what the birds have won and just describe the eye.........

if an eyesign "expert "could come to my club on basketting night, examine all the birds being sent and tell me which bird is going to win the race, then i would be a beleiver........

this doesnt mean i am totally against looking at the eyes, they are interesting...and like you point out, a winner never seems to have a bad looking eye does it........

if you look at one of our members called chanco who sadly died last year, you will find he offered 1,000 pounds on all the major pigeon forums challanging any eyesign expert to explain the theory and come to pick the winners from his pigeons, no one took the thousand pounds.............

David wrote:

i kev,

if an eyesign "expert "could come to my club on basketting night, examine all the birds being sent and tell me which bird is going to win the race, then i would be a beleiver........:

Hi David thats a good point but an eyesign expert cannot tell you what bird will win because he doesnt know what you fed it and how much you fed that bird or how well it is motivated.

He can however tell you which birds he thinks that you will have the most chance of breeding winners from.

It is Ideal for me as I have 130 pigeons of various ages from a champion fancier here in the Algarve that have been dormant in a huge aviary for 4 years or so, crying out to be bred from. So making the best pairs will be done by eyesign and it will also be a good test of the theory.

But it makes me laugh when a fancier hands me a bird and says what do you think of that bird? apart from feeling for silky feathers to repel bad weather and feeling for spongy muscles thats all I can do.

And most birds in modern racing lofts have those nowadays, I just say well you tell me because you know its racing results. Lol, but each to their own way of selecting.

hi kev, yes i agree in this situation you have with the 130 birds....all you can do really is go on eyesign and handling the birds, i say handling them because some eyesign judges not only evaluate the eys but also take how the birds handle in to account too.

jack barkel once told me that eyesign pairings can and does alter the build/shape of the bird, so this could be why birds which have supposed excellent eys have horrible bodies and never go on to win a race..........

i agree that the expert cannot take into account how the bird is fed etc, but i do think this is an excuse and a cop out for when their choice goes wrong.........as we all know luck already plays a part in racing so its no good saying this certain pigeon should win if it is fed right.

Hi David I would like to see someone handle all the birds going to the race and then pick out the winning bird that way by feel. Once again he would have no chance of success because he didnt prep the bird all he can say is its fit.

I know that loads of boney , angular birds that are struggling in the hand win races and that loads of pretty looking supposedly well balanced birds dont win anything.

The show pens are full of these pretty birds that arnt worth a carrot in a race or at least a long distance race.

Some fanciers are good at breeding birds others are better at racing birds a genuine eye sign man is a selector of breeding birds, it doesnt mean he or she has any talent for racing them or keeping them Healthy.

Hi I been looking at your excellant eye pictures and I think you have some cracking birds among them, I think a lot of racing eyes, which mostly in my opinion dont tell much but thats the way with racers. However I have looked at them closely and have a few ring numbers for you. They might turn out to be your worst birds and I will look a fool, but thats what these forums are for opinions and heres mine. If I were to start up these are the ones I would take home.
2011-1325503 racer /breeder
2005-5446091 breeder
2001-1486649 racer/breeder
2005-5679088 good racer
1986-886867 good racer
2001-1161624 breeder
1998-8430240 good breeder
2007-7501642 good distance racer /breeder

I would be interested if I have picked correctly or incorectly as you know there results and I dont, thanks.

no pictures of the throats
now that is theory that worked for me

so no one wants 2 free dvds on eye sign i still have them and i will pay postage if anyone wants them george

Ill take them mate send them to 73 gannet lane wellingborough nn8 4nw name chris

Chris will do village post office next opens saturday morning george

thats a very kind offer george, im sure chris will be very happy with them............well done george.

I have looked at the wooliss eyesign videos, and in most cases I find myself not convinced by him and I even disagree with him, he says he can predict racing ability from eyes which I find almost impossible except for super eyes.

steve b wrote:

no pictures of the throats
now that is theory that worked for me

i saw a dvd of geoff kirkland and frank tasker god rest his soul they were discussing and exsplaining about the throat theory ,very interesting but i do find the eyesign theory intrigueing but have to say i am undecided

there are too many factors involved to be able to predict how a pigeon will race by looking at the eyes, other pigeons in the race could also have good eyesign, be fed better or weather conditions....not to mention bops, wires etc..........

no, i dont beleive anyone can predict a race winner by looking at the eyes.........all they can do is sumise what they think the outcome will be.

Thanks ranbow

not one for eyesign theory dont know enough about it so cant really knock it

your right about rob woolliss he says the up north combine winner had a racing eye and the bird that it was bred from had a breeders eye and a bird that won the up north combine and bred a winner had a dual eye which was obvious thats when i'd had enough

best thing to do is breed them, train them, and race them.......see what happens.

the basket sorts them out

HI Kev i have had a look at all the eyes on show and i have selected a large amount this are pigeons which i would want to try in my own loft. TE is for top eye all the best mate

WHITE SPLIT RINGS 2 HENS
2006/6121564
2009/9048335
1997/7165913 TE
2000/352824

BLUE SPLIT HENS
1999/9012069
2000/228373
2001/1294995
2007/7501605
2010/140110
2010141113

GREEN SPLIT HENS
1999/9671232
2008/8253739
2011/1300099

WHITE RINGS HENS
2005/5518734
2005/5679088
2006/6127265
2007/7501622
20088486089
2008/8557540 TE


STOCK COCKS WHITE RINGS
1996/6398274
1997/7169501
1998/8430240 TE
2007/7633301
2004/4643551

ORANGE RINGS 3RD LOT
1986/886867 TE
1997/7169502 TE
2004/4643514
2005/5528988

PINK RINGS COCKS 2ND LOT
1998/8432014
2002/2642505
2008/8558796

GREEN RINGS 1ST LOT
2009/9048339

BREEDER HENS
2000/369692
2005/5520390
2010/237049

BREEDER COCKS
2010/37195
2005/744
2000/923732 NEVER SEEN A EYE LIKE THIS BEFORE???

And before Ian says anything "I KNOW NOTHING"

Don Webb wrote:

HI Kev i have had a look at all the eyes on show and i have selected a large amount this are pigeons which i would want to try in my own loft. TE is for top eye all the best mate

WHITE SPLIT RINGS 2 HENS
2006/6121564
2009/9048335
1997/7165913 TE
2000/352824

BLUE SPLIT HENS
1999/9012069
2000/228373
2001/1294995
2007/7501605
2010/140110
2010141113

GREEN SPLIT HENS
1999/9671232
2008/8253739
2011/1300099

WHITE RINGS HENS
2005/5518734
2005/5679088
2006/6127265
2007/7501622
20088486089
2008/8557540 TE


STOCK COCKS WHITE RINGS
1996/6398274
1997/7169501
1998/8430240 TE
2007/7633301
2004/4643551

ORANGE RINGS 3RD LOT
1986/886867 TE
1997/7169502 TE
2004/4643514
2005/5528988

PINK RINGS COCKS 2ND LOT
1998/8432014
2002/2642505
2008/8558796

GREEN RINGS 1ST LOT
2009/9048339

BREEDER HENS
2000/369692
2005/5520390
2010/237049

BREEDER COCKS
2010/37195
2005/744
2000/923732 NEVER SEEN A EYE LIKE THIS BEFORE???

And before Ian says anything "I KNOW NOTHING"

Hi Don firstly thanks for taking the trouble to look at these Eyeballs.
I know very little about eye sign I have an Expert from the USA looking at these eyes.
I am posting the actual pics of the super Eyes Cocks and Super eyes Hens on the site in their own files so you can see his picks. I will try to put why he picked them in the comments but it will be a few days before I can get the comments on but pics will be there in 20 mins or so.

I can tell you that the 2 birds you said Top eye both are and the bird with the weird eye is called a slot eye and I am going to try and mate him as an experiment.
you also selected 12 eyes that Myron agrees are super Eyes.

Thanks Kev.