Odiaxere Result Zubillaga, Spain 495 miles ST.W headwinds and poss Rain

Well the result is finally through and we got the final Bannana skin race out of the way and picked up valuable points for clocking 2 birds, we got 3 but its your 1st 2 that score the team points. It was a smash race that went on for 3 days, only 28 birds in race time some good fanciers got 1 bird or nothing , we got another bird on the morning of day 4 but he was out of race time as the race closed day 3. There should have been 36 birds to fill the top 20% but only 28 made it. WE ARE VAI & VEM
Clube Columbófilo Odeaxere
Lista de Chegada da Prova: 2013-15 PANCORBO
Data: 2013-06-08     Tipo: Fundo     Distância: 777.878     Enviados: 186
   

Faça clique sobre um pombo para ver os detalhes do concorrente nesta prova
Class.     Pombo     Chegada     Dias     Tempo Vôo     Média     Nome do Concorrente     Pontos




1 ]19****/10     20:47:27     1     14:47:27     876,5321     JOSE JOAQUIM CONCEICAO ALVES     100
2     19****/10     20:48:51     1     14:48:51     869,2218     SERGIO MANUEL JESUS ROSA     99
3     742****/07     21:13:03     1     15:13:03     851,9560     JOSE JOAQUIM CONCEICAO ALVES     98
4     904****/09     06:47:34     2     17:42:33     731,5044     JAMES MACFARLANE     97
5     19****/10     06:56:19     2     17:51:17     721,6180     LUIS MIGUEL GIL MESTRE     96
6     904****/09     07:10:05     2     18:05:03     711,3103     SANTOS, SANTOS & JUNIOR     95
7     19****/10     07:11:04     2     18:06:02     710,6662     SANTOS, SANTOS & JUNIOR     94
8     904****/09     07:55:29     2     18:50:27     683,4515     SERGIO MANUEL JESUS ROSA     93
9     162****/11     08:20:06     2     19:15:03     665,6313     AUTO STAND & GARCAO     92
10     131****/11     09:11:31     2     20:06:30     644,2264     JAMES MACFARLANE     91
11     904****/09     09:23:31     2     20:18:29     634,0733     SERGIO MANUEL JESUS ROSA     90
12     854****/08     10:00:10     2     20:55:08     615,9165     LUIS MIGUEL GIL MESTRE     89
13     130****/11     11:03:25     2     21:58:22     590,0344     FABIO ANDRE BOTELHO BAIAO     88
14     161****/11     11:12:01     2     22:06:58     579,3953     AUTO STAND & GARCAO     87
15     19****/10     12:02:06     2     22:57:04     560,4719     SANTOS, SANTOS & JUNIOR     86
16     19****/10     12:17:02     2     23:12:01     556,9406     ILIDIO JOSE MARQUES RODRIGUES     85
17     904****/09     12:22:14     2     23:17:13     556,7344     VAI & VEM     84
18     904****/09     12:42:40     2     23:37:38     544,9983     SERGIO MANUEL JESUS ROSA     83
19     19****/10     14:08:18     2     1.01:03:17     515,7181     ILIDIO JOSE MARQUES RODRIGUES     82
20     131****/11     14:23:39     2     1.01:18:38     512,2225     VAI & VEM     81
21     19****/10     14:34:44     2     1.01:29:43     506,8065     ILIDIO JOSE MARQUES RODRIGUES     80
22     19****/10     16:29:29     2     1.03:24:27     469,8275     SERGIO MANUEL JESUS ROSA     79
23     19****/10     19:09:55     2     1.06:04:54     428,5493     ACADEMIA KEEN & EMIDIO     78
24     162****/11     19:17:18     2     1.06:12:15     424,2460     AUTO STAND & GARCAO     77
25     18****/10     20:36:35     2     1.07:31:33     408,6899     LUIS MIGUEL GIL MESTRE     76
26     19****/10     06:57:29     3     1.10:48:07     372,5263     JOSE JOAQUIM CONCEICAO ALVES     75
27     904****/09     07:53:16     3     1.11:43:54     360,3920     LUIS FILIPE CARMO CORREIA     74
28     131****/11     10:19:58     3     1.14:10:37     339,5924     VAI & VEM     73

again well done to you

your aways in the hunt kev.
going well.

peel bros wrote:

again well done to you

True !!!!! Well done  I assume thou you have an electronic clock. If not, you would be knackered waiting for them I would say. In the past !!! I just loved those types of battles, which you have just experienced. Nothing but admiration from me for the little champs, when they hit the trap. Many a time I've just about cried or give them a kiss  when they have done it tough etc as yours could testify too.
*****

Cheers guys, and yes Knackered we do have an electric clock but I was there till 10pm on day 1 and then up at 5am to get to the loft before 6am on day 2, lol, we cobbled together a team for this long race and kept all but 1 of the better birds in the loft for the last 3 races of our season.(The birds that homed have earned their perch in the loft for next season, they are finished now this season as they flew their hearts out)
This was the last Long race of the season and as it has happened we have moved into 3rd place in the General race result for, sprint/middle and long distance.  We cannot be champions as we are too far behind but we can win the bronze medal. We can however still be champions of sprint and the Bronze wing is up for grabs in the Middle distance.
This week we are at Sardoal 175 miles, it is not a great racepoint for us as it is on the West side of North Portugal and we are in the West of Southern Portugal and the winds are almost always strong West blowing the birds in to the East to the Guys who measure longer and their birds get a blow home while ours fight a crosswind.
That being said we have to be optmistic as the birds are in fine fettle and some of the yearlings are re entering the fray. "Let battle commence"

well done kev and good luck lets hope you can pick up a prize atb

spencerline wrote:

Cheers guys, and yes Knackered we do have an electric clock but I was there till 10pm on day 1 and then up at 5am to get to the loft before 6am on day 2, lol, we cobbled together a team for this long race and kept all but 1 of the better birds in the loft for the last 3 races of our season.(The birds that homed have earned their perch in the loft for next season, they are finished now this season as they flew their hearts out)
This was the last Long race of the season and as it has happened we have moved into 3rd place in the General race result for, sprint/middle and long distance.  We cannot be champions as we are too far behind but we can win the bronze medal. We can however still be champions of sprint and the Bronze wing is up for grabs in the Middle distance.
This week we are at Sardoal 175 miles, it is not a great racepoint for us as it is on the West side of North Portugal and we are in the West of Southern Portugal and the winds are almost always strong West blowing the birds in to the East to the Guys who measure longer and their birds get a blow home while ours fight a crosswind.
That being said we have to be optmistic as the birds are in fine fettle and some of the yearlings are re entering the fray. "Let battle commence"

Interesting Kev, I must admit, since I have been here. I have enjoyed your post's in regard to the racing in your part of Portugal etc. In a kind way  I'm not an eye sign man. But !!!!!! differant strokes for differant folks & it all makes the world go round, as they say. Now !!!!!! 3 questions if I may (in for a penny in for a pound).
 1, Right hand side of your results etc, there are differant numbers beside the flyers "what does it mean" if I may ask.
2, You have mentioned that your loft is not at your place of residence etc I believe "how far do you have to travel, to the loft".
3, Eye sign  The 2 birds clocked in your recent smash race, were they in any way, differant to what I would call your spinters etc. If so, could you please explain to a curious bloke like me.
Finally !!!  Next time your talking to your good friend Myron "ask him"  does he miss his old mate ??????  "Mr eyesign" Bob Fleming.
*****

interesting reading kev.........

i will second that David

I will say that i have articals from the internet by Myron but i also have the book by Bob Fleming and it is very interesting what both say about this very interesting subject

And i think its everyone to there own but its what suits the individual and what they think works as everyone has different idears to eyesign

but for me its what i think is right for me but am always willing to learn different things and views from other fanciers

I will agree with the comment about Bob having issues with people not agreeing with him saw a few comments on a different site were Bob bet fanciers $1,000 that if he went to any loft he would be able to pick there best

That to me just shows the belief Bob has in his eyesign ability so fair play

i will second that David

I will say that i have articals from the internet by Myron but i also have the book by Bob Fleming and it is very interesting what both say about this very interesting subject

And i think its everyone to there own but its what suits the individual and what they think works as everyone has different idears to eyesign

but for me its what i think is right for me but am always willing to learn different things and views from other fanciers

I will agree with the comment about Bob having issues with people not agreeing with him saw a few comments on a different site were Bob bet fanciers $1,000 that if he went to any loft he would be able to pick there best

That to me just shows the belief Bob has in his eyesign ability so fair play

Bob Fleming used to resort to name calling and threats not just bets, I read many of the old posts years ago on the Commanche website where he did this and brought the Eyesign discussions into disrepute, it was a shame because he had a lot to offer the subject of eyesign instead he chose to deface it with his vulgar posts.
Myron too has great belief in his own methods and what he says has worked for me and many others, no question about that.
Bob Fleming was surely a great eyesign man but he left NO diagrams or pictures behind for anyone to carry on his work that  died with him years ago. And a lot of what he said can be interpreted different ways without proper diagrams to follow.

Myron came from Florida to stay with us in the Algarve for 10 days or so and while he and his wife Gloria were here we paired all of our stock birds up using his eyesign methods. They are all on young now so next season we will have 2 generations of birds bred using Eyesign as the tool. I did this small article on his visit and it has been published in the Racing Pigeon Digest in north America by the editor Gene Yoes.  http://algarvepigeonracing.webs.com/eyesign101algarvetrip.htm

i think all eyesign enthusiasts interperate it in their own way, the thing that gets me is those in the pictorial who merely describe the eye giving absolutely no reason why they think the bird is good or bad......and it usually turns out they already know the pigeons racing or breeding history beforehand..........

i remember one of our members who sadly died a year or so back, he posted up on all the major pigeon forums he would pay £1000 to any eyesign man who could explain the logic of eyesign, and go to his loft and pick out the winners, none ever took him up on his offer.........

Hi David,Well Myron would have had somebody paid his airfare from the USA, Scientists have recently proven beyond any doubt that pigeons use the magnetic field to navigate and they are almost certain that the information they glean from this is processed within the eyes. Also pigeons use their left eye to keep tabs on the leaders movements within a flock of pigeons.
Each bird has its own hierarchy within a group and the birds instinctively seem to know which birds are the best navigators. Once again this is recent info from scientists. The GPS trackers that are being developed for pigeons in Scotland by Kevin Murphy at Angus college will hopefully soon give us even more info on our birds and their habits.

interesting kev, but when you think its scientists who tell us global warming is real, when its a lie........it makes you wonder doessnt it.

Global warming has nothing to do with pigeons ability to home, although it is true and it is happening. As the ice caps melt more sea is exposed to sunlight. Wheras before the Ice caps used to reflect the heat, now the exposed water evaporates and goes into the atmosphere, therefore more rain. It is unlucky for the UK that most of it seems to be falling there, lol.
As to what is causing Global warming who knows for sure but it is happening, you only have to look at the Columbia Icefields in Alberta Canada and the massive shrinkage of it to see that global warming is happening.

yes a natural cycle is happening thats true, but 4 x 4`s and plastic carrier bags arnt causing it.........

spencerline wrote:

Bob Fleming used to resort to name calling and threats not just bets, I read many of the old posts years ago on the Commanche website where he did this and brought the Eyesign discussions into disrepute, it was a shame because he had a lot to offer the subject of eyesign instead he chose to deface it with his vulgar posts.
Myron too has great belief in his own methods and what he says has worked for me and many others, no question about that.
Bob Fleming was surely a great eyesign man but he left NO diagrams or pictures behind for anyone to carry on his work that  died with him years ago. And a lot of what he said can be interpreted different ways without proper diagrams to follow.

Myron came from Florida to stay with us in the Algarve for 10 days or so and while he and his wife Gloria were here we paired all of our stock birds up using his eyesign methods. They are all on young now so next season we will have 2 generations of birds bred using Eyesign as the tool. I did this small article on his visit and it has been published in the Racing Pigeon Digest in north America by the editor Gene Yoes.  http://algarvepigeonracing.webs.com/eyesign101algarvetrip.htm

Great article and enjoyed it big time

Kev as you say it is a shame when things turn nasty because this does not need to happen but i understand what you say about Bob, and with the comments i read there were quite afew offencesive comments which were a little below the belt.

Which was not called for shame all the same

spencerline wrote:

Bob Fleming used to resort to name calling and threats not just bets, I read many of the old posts years ago on the Commanche website where he did this and brought the Eyesign discussions into disrepute, it was a shame because he had a lot to offer the subject of eyesign instead he chose to deface it with his vulgar posts.
Myron too has great belief in his own methods and what he says has worked for me and many others, no question about that.
Bob Fleming was surely a great eyesign man but he left NO diagrams or pictures behind for anyone to carry on his work that  died with him years ago. And a lot of what he said can be interpreted different ways without proper diagrams to follow.

Myron came from Florida to stay with us in the Algarve for 10 days or so and while he and his wife Gloria were here we paired all of our stock birds up using his eyesign methods. They are all on young now so next season we will have 2 generations of birds bred using Eyesign as the tool. I did this small article on his visit and it has been published in the Racing Pigeon Digest in north America by the editor Gene Yoes.  http://algarvepigeonracing.webs.com/eyesign101algarvetrip.htm

Kev must say i do have Bob's book which i find a very interesting read mate with the diagrames and pictures

David wrote:

interesting reading kev.........

Yes !!!!!! it was a truly interesting/good read. So thank's very much Kev for your quite lengthy reply to my queries. It does appear your able to lay your hands on birds for all distances etc, so you are in a most fortunate position I would have to say. The travelling which you have to do for your birds would be quite daunting to me. I'm just happy to roll down the hill (back yard) & grumble when I have to walk up it etc here. One thing I found with your mate Myron, was that he wasn't a grumpy old bastard like Fleming who would cut you of at the knees without blinking an eye if you didn't go along with his theory's. Years ago when it was war on the american site etc that they battled each other on I often thought to my self we should have a pigeon moot (I think that's you blokes call it)  just to sort the eyesign subject out finally so to speak. It went like this, on the left "Mr eyesign" Bob Fleming & on the right "Myron" & just to keep things on an even keel . Jack Barkel in the middle. I would have travelled half way round the world to see such a thing.

one question i would like to know, if two eyesign men evaluated an eye, would they both come up with the same verdict ? would they both say the pigeon was a good one or would they have conflicting opinions by one saying its a champion and the other saying its a duffer.....?

if so who`s opinion do you go with .....?

 

can eyesign only be used to any advantage if you have studdied your own family of birds, and know what type of eye does well in certain races.....?

for example a weak /pale iris may only win on an easy, blow home day.......on a harder day it might go down, never to be seen again ???

Knackered wrote:

David wrote:

interesting reading kev.........

Yes !!!!!! it was a truly interesting/good read. So thank's very much Kev for your quite lengthy reply to my queries. It does appear your able to lay your hands on birds for all distances etc, so you are in a most fortunate position I would have to say. The travelling which you have to do for your birds would be quite daunting to me. I'm just happy to roll down the hill (back yard) & grumble when I have to walk up it etc here. One thing I found with your mate Myron, was that he wasn't a grumpy old bastard like Fleming who would cut you of at the knees without blinking an eye if you didn't go along with his theory's. Years ago when it was war on the american site etc that they battled each other on I often thought to my self we should have a pigeon moot (I think that's you blokes call it)  just to sort the eyesign subject out finally so to speak. It went like this, on the left "Mr eyesign" Bob Fleming & on the right "Myron" & just to keep things on an even keel . Jack Barkel in the middle. I would have travelled half way round the world to see such a thing.

I would also have liked to see that

David wrote:

can eyesign only be used to any advantage if you have studdied your own family of birds, and know what type of eye does well in certain races.....?

for example a weak /pale iris may only win on an easy, blow home day.......on a harder day it might go down, never to be seen again ???

David, I would say the eyesign experts would say No, in my case I would say Yes, to the first part above etc.
Now !!!!!!!! Eye sign in part is no differant to the many other theories in pigeons whether it be wing/long/short, pearl/yellow/green eye etc. Feed !!, my mind boggles at all the differant mixes one can buy, keel long/short, the list one could say is endless in the sport of pigeons. Nature in the most part has the final say. Today we are better educated/smarter & surposed to have the knowledge to manage things etc far better than 50 odd years ago as an example. My view is something has gone wrong "Big Time" & not only in the sport of pigeons. I take all theories with a grain of salt so to speak & when certain people for their own reasons state them as a fact & cannot be disputed I just switch off I'm afraid, even if they believe they have the knowledge. If we all lived in the perfect world & eyesign was the answer, perhapes all the problems we all know would not exist.