Per Pigeon Space in Loft

Hi Friends,
we discuss all the time that good loft management can leads to good results I believe in that too we also know that overcrowd is not good and can cause several diseases.

My question is regarding loft size and birds it can accommodate. What do you think is good space to consider for a pigeon? For me I think there could some measurement options too, but what I do , I make sure good ventilation in loft. one of my loft is 5*5*6.5 ft (excluding aviary) I install perch 10inch apart in height and 6 inch gap between perch.in this way I install perch that define capacity for me but sometimes I reduce my birds even I have vacant perches in it. my lofts has covered section and aviary on front. whether winter or summer, I observed that pigeon wants to sit inside covered section , specially in evening and only opt to sit on perch in aviary if he has no good space inside. so if my pigeon start living in aviary, it is a indicator for me for overcrowd and I move them to other loft where space is available

what are your thoughts ?

Thanks

hi tanveer...what i do is measure the length of the loft by the width and divide by 3 and thats the number of pigeons i would have in that space

tanveerhbaig wrote:

Hi Friends,
we discuss all the time that good loft management can leads to good results I believe in that too we also know that overcrowd is not good and can cause several diseases.

My question is regarding loft size and birds it can accommodate. What do you think is good space to consider for a pigeon? For me I think there could some measurement options too, but what I do , I make sure good ventilation in loft. one of my loft is 5*5*6.5 ft (excluding aviary)   I install perch 10inch apart in height and 6 inch gap between perch.in this way I install perch that define capacity for me but sometimes I reduce my birds even I have vacant perches in it. my lofts has covered section and aviary on front. whether winter or summer, I observed that pigeon wants to sit inside covered section , specially in evening and only opt to sit on perch in aviary if he has no good space inside. so if my pigeon start living in aviary, it is a indicator for me for overcrowd and I move them to other loft where space is available

what are your thoughts ?

Thanks    

My thoughts Tanveer are your concerned about something etc that you should not be really concerned about as such
on average. Advise, all with good intent here I'm sure will flow with wisdom attached, but from my pespective it's all total bollocks I'm from my experience & for what I've seen first hand in a local sense . Pick our beloved Ray here as an example & then think of a man, that is every bit as good or even I suggest is maybe even better & is a Icon for his deeds in a racing sense against large numbers & his loft is 20Ft x 6/7ft maybe, dug 2ft into the ground & it has 250/280 odd pigeons in it of pure class by local standards & when he wants a few extra perches he just fills the floor with bricks to make his champs happy & comfortable in winter . Now           happy to take all abuse here with this one as such     but please take/keep in mind     I've seen in my time, gold cup winners, squills type champions all migrate with their wisdom & tales of glory of home & then race local & they mostly have just been, just run of the mill nothing type pigeon flyers in the end    .
*****

great little spout oz at the end of the day its what yer comfortable with in the loft but climate and ventilation will come into play also ,a flight will enable more numbers

I am with you here Knackered

Too many theories not enough research.

Seen lofts that would be called over crowded by the experts that beat the experts out of sight.

What matters is the quality of the air within the loft.

You will fond exceptions in every aspect of our sport.


However, for myself I always had a number of empty perches, it stopped fighting for perches ( used by some as an incentive to fly better) and was a means of contentment and love of their home the best possible incentive and not an on and off.

For every so called experts opinion there will be numerous better fanciers using exactly the opposite, that is what makes it interesting.

If there was a fool proof way everyone would now be aware of it.

Regards.

thank you all. my intention was to get best practice . It seems on whatever system if birds returned, it is good for that individual

There are no set rules. You have an aviary? Good enough. Ventilation? Well below freezing wind blows in to one loft I have. No heat.
Banded 6 young birds today. 2 were in a loft that did not have lights on. Dark from 5 pm to 8 am. They all look robust. The lofts with the lights young are no different from loft without. Each to their own.

i have a widowhood section 8x6 ft maximum of 12 birds ,hens section same size for 16 birds,stock section same size 6 pairs,yb section is same size also but with a 5x6 feet flight for maximum of 30 ybs (40 perches though) but of course they thin out as the season progresses also the ybs are not about in winter so lofts are more open spring/summer ...as misty says the crucial element is ventilation and get that right you can indeed house more birds but i like to feel comfortable in the lofts and see whats going on with each bird and get to know them ,to me thats more important but other ways work to and as mentioned many winners have come from crowded lofts so cant knock it if you like alot of birds about you ,some people like that

halcanada80 wrote:

There are no set rules.  You have an aviary? Good enough. Ventilation? Well below freezing wind blows in to one loft I have. No heat.
Banded 6 young birds today.  2 were in a loft that did not have lights on. Dark from 5 pm to 8 am. They all look robust. The lofts with the lights young are no different from loft without. Each to their own.

Absolutely true Hal I had a god like creature when young in pigeon terms etc & even today I still at times read his books as such & the best way to describe him, would be to say he was like our beloved Ray here     a chook farmer type of some repute. Now I did a small calculation ( in my head I'm  ) & using O/S's formula for his birds & if he just kept his birds under the same scenario believe it or not his loft would have been 1,333ft long .  Now       just to take the pain away here for some & maybe I'm just wrong with my calculation the man was called Levi & in his day he just kept, 20,000 odd pigeons for the sheer enjoyment factor type of thing  .

The funny thing about pigeons is they have a mind of their own.

You can have all the ideal circumstances YOU feel right and they just tell you do not know what you are talking about.

In many a loft with what we feel ideal pigeons will nest in the most unusual and inconvenient place and also perch in places not intended.

I have found in many cases they are some of the best although at times tiresome.

Regards.

How many could you house in a tree. A square foot for each bird.  In Canada, the government ruling is Width x height x length = square feet! Seen lofts where the droppings are very high on floor and any nest perching etc. Pigeons just out of pecking range - till accepted and allowed to be nearer. State of pigeons? First class and in immaculate condition. How do they race... Extremely well.
You know, on the basis of 'Many myths become legends, and many legends become myths'. It matters not! One thing for certain is the more there is, the more content they are and better the racing and fewer the losses. Proven time after time. But too many want to treat as 'Human'!
Spouting 'What IFit was you?!
Misty says' … I have found in many cases they are some of the best although at times tiresome'.
Very true... like the ones adamant they will build nests under the loft … or nowhere'! I believe to a large extent a pigeon merits a broad spectrum of doing what it wants for easier and better results.

Middle of North Atlantic. Spring and Autumn. Getting near dusk. Many hundereds of birds would land on the ship. Followed by raptors. The birds? Red Polls. Tiny little things. Some other species also. All birds that survive have instinct and intelligence. Pigeons also. But if pampered those traits get less strong.

Levi was a pigeon farmer. Raised them for meat.

halcanada80 wrote:

Levi was a pigeon farmer. Raised them for meat.

I knew that etc Hal Always did/have as such That part of his history was covered under my type of thing ending . End of the day thou hard to repute, he wasn't a man of great knowledge in a pigeon sense I suggest . Now     talk about old school or I'm       some who refuses to go modern in a pigeon sense     I know a bloke, well     that if as I waffle here, he went under his house       to his goodies box, you would find 3/4 items that Levi highly recommended in the cause of keeping his wee little flock healthy & well as such    .  

Daz wrote:

How many could you house in a tree. A square foot for each bird.  In Canada, the government ruling is Width x height x length = square feet! Seen lofts where the droppings are very high on floor and any nest perching etc. Pigeons just out of pecking range - till accepted and allowed to be nearer. State of pigeons? First class and in immaculate condition. How do they race... Extremely well.
You know, on the basis of 'Many myths become legends, and many legends become myths'. It matters not! One thing for certain is the more there is, the more content they are and better the racing and fewer the losses. Proven time after time. But too many want to treat as 'Human'!
Spouting 'What IFit was you?!
Misty says' … I have found in many cases they are some of the best although at times tiresome'.
Very true... like the ones adamant they will build nests under the loft … or nowhere'! I believe to a large extent a pigeon merits a broad spectrum of doing what it wants for easier and better results.

Always think here etc Daz of those old type dove cotes farmers kept on their farms of a long gone era. No body count done there I suggest but those that lived there in some ways always found a happy balance type scenario for survival etc .

Yes Knackered. Quite a few follow his advice. Being in the rasing of many animals in restricted spaces , hogs, appreciate his ability overcome associated problems.
However, modern day fanciers have a different goal. To have the best to race. Trial and error to start. Then a plan gets formed then try it. Parts work keep them. Discard other aspects and try something else. Ad infinitum.

halcanada80 wrote:

Yes Knackered. Quite a few follow his advice. Being in the rasing of many animals in restricted spaces , hogs, appreciate his ability overcome associated problems.
However, modern day fanciers  have a different goal. To have the best to race. Trial and error to start. Then a plan gets formed then try it. Parts work keep them. Discard other aspects and try something else. Ad infinitum.

Maybe true as you say Hal actually it is true as you say. But not everyone gets caught up in the spin & bling scenario of today I suggest of what must be done to achieve results. A fine example is of a Vet I know etc talk the talk, the man is a wizard but come race day a different story unfolds much of the  time, on average    .

True Knackered.
Seen once, when a farm hand went up to knock an old shed down. The roof was caved in, and water got through etc. Nesting places every where... Was a good number when circling etc.
The older one he caught, and the babes and squabs ready to fly were in fantastic condition.

yes i have also seen pigeons nesting in daft places but only in crowded lofts ...we had 8 cocks in a 8x6 feet section daz ,they had 9 races on the bounce at the end we still had 7/8 and won the english averages ,so to say the birds are happier and less loses when in many numbers is not the case for me ...no one size fits all with pigeons

I, Oldstrain have 16 nest boxes in 6 X 5. Another 12 nest boxes next door. The third 7 x 6 housed the youngsters. Agreed all have an airvary later. Trouble was Got over run with pigeons lol.
Later put a stock when I built the brick one. But the compartments were the same. Had 2-3 pairs always determined to nest on floor. A made a wooden 'Tea- Cosy contraption and placed over the nest. Best thing was that they eyed another nest directly opposite lol.
Kept eye on the birds feeding too. Great natural protectiveness inbuilt lol. Gosh did they trap lol.