young birds systems

Young Bird racing can be very exciting and lucrative. Good ones will perform with
distinction from 50 miles to 450 miles on the day of liberation. I look forward to the
first 500 miles young bird on the day into the UK.
In the York area in England, my birds were twice first five open and twice first three
open from 6 races with other positions. At the time, I was ahead of the game
described as follows;
Feeding:
Hoppers of layers pellets at all times. The birds were called in at tea time (around
5pm) to a mixture of Haiths Widowhood Sprint Corn, Peanuts, Redband (Condition
Seed) and Brewers Yeast.
Water:
Wednesday - Fruit Spoon of “Bovril” / Gallon Water
Sunday - Fruit Spoon of “Bovril” / Gallon Water
Thursday/Friday - “Aviform”
Saturday (Race Day) - “Chevita Multivit”
Before Basketing: Mycosan ‘t’ and Chlortetracycline & mixed together on Thursday
and Friday. The Birds were psyched up to the eyeballs.
Exercise:
The birds ranged the skies on open loft from 5:30am onwards (Summer).
Training:
I liked a 90 mile toss on Wednesday.
Fielding:
My birds sat on wires and fed on Barley in the fields around the village of Holtby,
York.
My Secret:
The night before basketing the birds were kept in the house back room with no feed
and water in the baskets. They got warm and were really keen to get home.
Psychology:
I mobilised the birds instincts to survive and get home as quickly as possible.
Result:
It was a joy to watch the shiny beauties racing flat out to the loft.
The Strain of Bird:
The birds were of the Emerton Strain 71 to 879 miles. You just alter the management
systems as the distance gets higher.
Photo ‘A’ - Dorothy Emerton at 90 years old with “Diabolos” (pigeon aged 22) in the
garden of “Sycamore Cottage, Holtby, York, England
Photo ‘B’ - Dorothy Emerton with “Freddie” and corn tins on a race day waiting for
birds. She tended the birds until 91 years of age - “An Indominatable Inspiration

Typical antibiotic induced system. Sorry mate, don't agree with it.

Gary Burgess wrote:

Typical antibiotic induced system. Sorry mate, don't agree with it.

so you know better than jim emerton lol

I know about antibiotic abuse and it's implications. Creatine and antibiotics a great combination mate, why not chuck a bit of Acetyl l-carnitine in there as well just for a good measure.
I know better than to dose my birds with antibiotics, do you know they do to your birds immune system. Have you ever come across the term antibiotic resistant bacteria. This comes from the over use of antibiotics.
That's my opinion.

Gary Burgess wrote:

I know about antibiotic abuse and it's implications. Creatine and antibiotics a great combination mate, why not chuck a bit of Acetyl l-carnitine in there as well just for a good measure.
I know better than to dose my birds with antibiotics, do you know they do to your birds immune system. Have you ever come across the term antibiotic resistant bacteria. This comes from the over use of antibiotics.
That's my opinion.

its not my system its taken from jim emmertons writings but i will tell you one thing i once asked a doctor he said if you could get imune which he stated you cant it would take over 10 years lol and your entittled to your opinion mate cheers sean lol

Just a little something for you look over when you have time, your arguement is flawed. I am well educated in the misuse of antibiotics.
I never use them. Any novice fancier Take heed.





ANTIBIOTICS
Antibiotics – Don't Use Them.
By: Alan Wheeldon
Email: alan.wheeldon@btinternet.com


The use of antibiotics by pigeon fanciers should be banned. Pigeon fanciers don't know what they are doing when it comes to treating pigeons with antibiotics, and what is worse; they are causing untold damage.

Typically, most fanciers look at the pigeon's symptoms, guess what the disease is, they guess what to treat the disease with, and they guess what dose to use. Pigeon fanciers don't know how, or when, to use antibiotics properly. They give their pigeons antibiotics to treat diseases caused by viruses.

Antibiotics do not kill viruses. The reason given for using antibiotics for viral infection, is to prevent the secondary infection caused by opportunistic bacteria. The truth is that the antibiotics cause the appearance of the opportunistic bacteria in the first place.

All the good pigeon friendly bacteria are killed, leaving way for the antibiotic-resistant bacteria that cause disease, to move in. Fanciers will, in ignorance, give antibiotics for almost anything; paramyxovirus, adenovirus, herpes, coccidiosis, hexamita, even worms.

Antibiotics are no good against any of these ailments but as soon as there is anything wrong, pigeon fanciers are off to get the 'yellow powder' to put in the water. A bloke down the pub can get hold of some, the corn merchant can get some, a mate down the pigeon club has got some in a cardboard box at home.

How much do they put in the water.........who knows? What exactly is the 'yellow powder'.......who knows? How strong is this magic powder......who knows? How long should they give the yellow powder for....who knows?

Even when the cause of the problem really is bacterial they use the wrong antibiotics for the wrong bacteria. For example, there is really only one antibiotic effective against the worst strains of Salmonella, but does the average fancier know that......?

In fact does the average pigeon fancier know anything about antibiotics. Well let's find out. Here's a test. Go down the pigeon club and ask if anyone knows the correct antibiotic for Chlamydia. Then ask them what the symptoms are for Salmonellosis, and how they can tell it from Chlamydia.

Then ask them what is the difference between, 'Auremycin', 'Ornicure' and 'Terramycin'. Ask them, for how long they should administer Enrofloxacin? I suspect that none will know the answers, and yet I bet that most have used antibiotics at some time......for something.

To be sure of totally, and effectively eradicating bacterial infection, most antibiotics should be administered for 14-21 days. How many fanciers have the knowledge, or even the patience to keep up that treatment? Some just add the antibiotic powder to the water for just 2-5 days.

This is not long enough. Any recovery they see in their pigeons is happening in spite of the antibiotics. The pigeon is fighting the infection primarily on it's own. Furthermore, what is remarkable, is that to get antibiotics to treat humans, you need a prescription from the doctor.

You can't just buy them for yourself at the chemists. This is to limit their inappropriate and indiscriminate use. Similarly if you want antibiotics to treat your dog or cat you need firstly to have the pet examined by a vet. But access to antibiotics to treat pigeons seems to be under no such control.

Antibiotics can very easily be obtained within pigeon circles, usually from someone who buys them when they go abroad, where controls are less vigorously enforced. Even when fanciers obtain antibiotics legitimately, from a reputable vet, and follow the instructions to the letter, it can still turn out to be a complete waste of time and money.

Evidence? In Holland, at the University of Utrecht, all the antibiotics sold for treating pigeons were evaluated, and the doses recommended by the manufacturer were compared with their effectiveness at killing bacterial infections. They found that only 3 of the recommended dosages out of 60 formulations marketed were correct.

It was concluded that the majority of treatments are unlikely to work. The reason for this is that the so-called pigeon antibiotics were never developed for pigeons. They were first developed for humans, then adapted for farm animals like pigs and chickens, and for common pets like cats and dogs.

Few, if any, trials have been carried out on pigeons. It's no wonder the manufacturers have to guess the dose. The antibiotics are not even administered on an individual basis to the pigeons. Fanciers just throw some powder into the drinkers.

So how much is each pigeon getting? How much will the pigeon absorb? Will it achieve blood levels high enough to kill the bacteria? Will the pigeon's metabolism break down the antibiotic and excrete it before it can work? If you give too much is it toxic?

None of these questions have been answered. The Dutch study concluded that if all the antimicrobials sold for treating pigeons had to be registered under the Dutch medicines act 1985 they would nearly all be rejected because of poor pharmacokinetics and bacteriological efficacy.

To make things worse, fanciers are even giving antibiotics when there are no symptoms, just in case! So what, you might ask, it can't do any harm........can it? It most certainly can! The indiscriminate use of antibiotics is about to cause the biggest disaster that has hit the pigeon world.......ever.

Let me explain to the irresponsible scribes in the fancy press that keep extolling the virtues of antibiotics, and I include all the qualified vets in that category......if we don't stop using antibiotics a new killer superbug will evolve. A bug so resistant that it will chomp up any antibiotic that we throw at it.

All life on two legs will become plagued by untreatable life threatening bacterial infection, and that includes the pigeon fancier as well. Scare mongering? I think not. I'm not the only one who is thinking along these lines. Let me tell you a story.

In America the Federal Drug Agency has banned the use of antibiotics by American poultry farmers. The reason.........new antibiotic resistant bacteria are springing up that cause untreatable gastric illness in chickens........and yes, in humans. But that's only just a one off isn't it.............wrong! In hospitals, doctors and nurses are at the moment fighting an uphill battle.

The cause is MRSA Methicillin-resistant Staphlococcus Aureus. If a patient coming out of an operation gets the bug it can dramatically reduce their chances of survival. Patients are dying, not because of their illness or surgery, but because of septicaemia.

All patients being moved between hospitals have to be screened for this potentially deadly bacteria, and if someone is carrying it, they go straight into isolation, because once this bug gets out into the ward there is very little out there to kill it. It is resistant to nearly all known antibiotics.

It's rapidly becoming untreatable! Furthermore, two million people a year die of Tuberculosis, one new person per second is contracting the disease. But that's not a problem in Britain is it........? Yes I'm afraid so. 70-100 people entering Heathrow airport a year are detected as having TB.

They are X-rayed and given treatment to prevent the spread into the large cities like London, but people still slip through. In America they are taking the threat of a TB epidemic very seriously. In 1997 in New York they spent 1 billion dollars to try to control the spread of the disease.

But TB is easy to clear up.....isn't it? Wrong!.....a person with TB has to take 6-7 antibiotics per day for SIX months to be sure of recovery. Why so many antibiotics, for so long? TB has evolved to become resistant.

It is now known as Multi drug-resistant Tuberculosis......MDRTB, and because of that, many classes of antibiotics have to be taken to make sure that that the sufferers are using at least one antibiotic that's effective. However the list of effective antibiotics that can be used to fight TB is getting shorter.

The reason? Over-prescribing and over-use of antibiotics. In the past doctors were so keen to give out antibiotics they treated them like sweets. If you went to the doctor with a cold you were given......antibiotics. If you went there with a cough you were given.....antibiotics.

Sure they killed some bugs but the bacteria that were resistant were left untouched, and suddenly with all the other bacteria out of the way they didn't have any competition. They multiplied and filled the spaces left by the good bugs.

Does this scenario sound familiar to anyone. Read any of the pigeon journals. There is always some scribe telling everyone to use antibiotics for something. One of them proclaimed that as soon as his pigeons looked a bit off, he'd give them antibiotics. Well if he sticks to that regime soon his pigeons will look more than just a bit off.....their droppings will be liquid, they will be throwing up, losing weight and falling over......dead.

He is creating just the right conditions for Antibiotic-Resistant Salmonellosis......ARS......and he is one, because if such a bug gets out and invades the poultry industry we will have to kill all our pigeons. Surely the Ministry of agriculture fisheries and foods (MAFF) wouldn't make us do that would they?

All I can say to that is BSE........over 100,000 cattle slaughtered to prevent the spread of the disease. Porcine swine fever.........tens of thousands of pigs killed to contain the infection. In the sixties Foot and mouth disease.........212,000 cattle, 108,000 sheep and 114,000 pigs slaughtered, need I go on.
The MAFF are unlikely to risk the destruction of the billion pound poultry industry, so that a few people can race pigeons. Remember, it was the MAFF that proclaimed paramyxovirus a notifiable disease in pigeons, and instigated compulsory vaccination to prevent the spread to poultry farms. So they have the power.
So, is the appearance and spread of a superbug just fantasy? Well, let us just look around. In the 1940's penecillin could easily destroy the bacteria that causes meningitis, well today, in the United States, due to over prescribing, three quarters of the meningitis causing bacteria are resistant to it. Now outbreaks of meningitis have never been so high.

In Greece where antibiotics are available over the counter over half of all the bacteria in circulation are resistant to treatment. In the bird world, in Kenya where antibiotics are added to chicken feed, chicken guts now are full of bacteria totally resistant to tetracycline.

Exactly how serious is the situation? Well, in Madagascar a single strain of plague bacillus is now resistant to ampicillin, chloramphenicol, streptomycin, kanamycin, tetracycline,and the sulphonamides. Yes I'll repeat that.....PLAGUE. We are not talking acne here......this is plague. If that gets out we are in real trouble.

More frighteningly, once the superbugs move in there is no shifting them, you're stuck with them for life. Evidence? In Norway a broiler farm was hit by Vancomycin-resistant Enterococci, VRE, due to the use of antibiotics in the feed. They killed all the chickens, stripped down the whole place, scrubbed it out completely with bleach and germicides.

They put in new stock from a clean hatchery and within three weeks all the new chickens had VRE. It only takes the ingestion of one resistant bacteria and before long there are millions of them. There are over one million bacteria in the guts of a pigeon.

There are about two million pigeons in Britain. That's two billion bacteria.......luckily most of them friendly. But if pigeon fanciers keep using antibiotics, they will wipe out all the friendly bacteria, and guess what will move into their place.......the antibiotic resistant ones....the killers.

So if you get an antibiotic resistant strain in your loft, you will probably never be able to race again. You will have to kill all of your birds in the loft assuming they haven't died already, burn down the loft, and move. Even that will only work if you are not a carrier.

Perhaps you don't use antibiotics. Well don't think that because of that you are safe. If someone down your club does use them, and his pigeons carry an antibiotic resistant strain of bacteria, and your pigeons go into the same race crate, they will share the same drinker, stand in the same droppings, and eat the same food off of the floor during a holdover.

The process of infestation by an antibiotic-resistant strain of bacteria can be very rapid as the entire bacterial population in the guts of a pigeon can be completely replaced in as little as 20 minutes.

So what is the solution. Stop using antibiotics, stop reading articles proclaiming the use of antibiotics, tell your mates to stop using them, stop buying antibiotics, and don't let your vet give you any antibiotics, get rid of any pigeons that are persistently sick and let your loft build up it's own natural immunity. Only then, will pigeon racing, and probably mankind, have a safer future.

Naaa!.....I hear you say.......this is all in the future it won't bother us now. Well just open up your pigeon paper and see the new 'service' that is being offered by the vets...........antibiotic-sensitivity testing!........The bacteria found in pigeon droppings have started to become antibiotic-resistant! So watch out pigeons.......the superbugs are on their way!

very good who says he is correct though sean

Frank Harper , Gordon A Chalmers just to name two.

The Ten Commandments?
Extracted from "Problem Droppings Explained" (Page 53 - Treatment)
Try to find what is wrong with the birds.
Poor droppings are only a symptom, there is a cause - the "why" behind the need for any treatment. (Put another way, there is no such disease as "bad droppings", treatment should be aimed at removing the cause, not just suppressing the symptoms.) As well as "why", you need to know "what" you are giving. A name on a packet should not be enough for the intelligent fancier. The packet labels on Dutch products are more informative than on Belgian products. Even though the label is in Dutch, the "enhalte" (contents) should tell you enough to recognise the drugs used - the language of chemistry is international! (An important consideration when using imported products. Trade names differ, but it is the active component that carries the important information. For example, if you are looking to change your anti-trichomonal treatment, a simple change of brand-name may result in the use of the same drug. The situation worsens when the active component cannot be identified. Reliable information on past medication (even when unsuccessful) can be a valuable time saver when dealing with problem cases).

Always full dose for full time.
Antibacterials are bacterial poisons, they need to be given in high enough/long enough doses. Unless this is achieved, the surviving bacteria are those that were the most resistant and hand this resistance on to following generations. Draw your own analogy with poisoning rats - you don't leave out a "little bit" of poison once a week. Yet so many fanciers take this approach to antibiotics and to anti-trichomonals in particular.

Mix in a bucket, not the drinker
Birds have died from overdose of unmixed medicine. Mix medicines well! This particularly applies to Tiamulin, where a concentrated solution can kill so quickly, that the birds do not even get away from the drinker. If you have started, finish it. Do not "chop and change" in mid- treatment. (Remember the ability of bacteria to develop drug resistance. Not only in subsequent generations, but resistance can be transferred to other, unrelated bacteria present at the time).

Too many imported products are blunderbuss treatments.
They have to be by their nature, the makers know nothing of your birds. Why give five antibiotics, with all the drawbacks, when one correct choice will do the job? (This is a British veterinary perspective. Although effective in some cases, such a blunderbuss approach - "give them a bit of everything, since we don't know what is wrong" - is second best to an accurate diagnosis and targeted treatment).

Don't hand on "bits left over".
The next fancier may not need the same, nor have enough. (It happens all the time, usually with the best of intentions, but now we are back where we started - ignoring the "why", the "what" the "high enough/long enough dose"

When you understand these principles, you can start to see some of the reasons why our birds and our sport are going wrong.

Ten commandments?

We have only covered eight. two are missing,
but then that's pigeon racing!

Frank Harper

Gary Burgess wrote:

Just a little something for you look over when you have time, your arguement is flawed. I am well educated in the misuse of antibiotics.
I never use them. Any novice fancier Take heed.





ANTIBIOTICS
Antibiotics – Don't Use Them.
By: Alan Wheeldon
Email: alan.wheeldon@btinternet.com


The use of antibiotics by pigeon fanciers should be banned. Pigeon fanciers don't know what they are doing when it comes to treating pigeons with antibiotics, and what is worse; they are causing untold damage.

Typically, most fanciers look at the pigeon's symptoms, guess what the disease is, they guess what to treat the disease with, and they guess what dose to use. Pigeon fanciers don't know how, or when, to use antibiotics properly. They give their pigeons antibiotics to treat diseases caused by viruses.

Antibiotics do not kill viruses. The reason given for using antibiotics for viral infection, is to prevent the secondary infection caused by opportunistic bacteria. The truth is that the antibiotics cause the appearance of the opportunistic bacteria in the first place.

All the good pigeon friendly bacteria are killed, leaving way for the antibiotic-resistant bacteria that cause disease, to move in. Fanciers will, in ignorance, give antibiotics for almost anything; paramyxovirus, adenovirus, herpes, coccidiosis, hexamita, even worms.

Antibiotics are no good against any of these ailments but as soon as there is anything wrong, pigeon fanciers are off to get the 'yellow powder' to put in the water. A bloke down the pub can get hold of some, the corn merchant can get some, a mate down the pigeon club has got some in a cardboard box at home.

How much do they put in the water.........who knows? What exactly is the 'yellow powder'.......who knows? How strong is this magic powder......who knows? How long should they give the yellow powder for....who knows?

Even when the cause of the problem really is bacterial they use the wrong antibiotics for the wrong bacteria. For example, there is really only one antibiotic effective against the worst strains of Salmonella, but does the average fancier know that......?

In fact does the average pigeon fancier know anything about antibiotics. Well let's find out. Here's a test. Go down the pigeon club and ask if anyone knows the correct antibiotic for Chlamydia. Then ask them what the symptoms are for Salmonellosis, and how they can tell it from Chlamydia.

Then ask them what is the difference between, 'Auremycin', 'Ornicure' and 'Terramycin'. Ask them, for how long they should administer Enrofloxacin? I suspect that none will know the answers, and yet I bet that most have used antibiotics at some time......for something.

To be sure of totally, and effectively eradicating bacterial infection, most antibiotics should be administered for 14-21 days. How many fanciers have the knowledge, or even the patience to keep up that treatment? Some just add the antibiotic powder to the water for just 2-5 days.

This is not long enough. Any recovery they see in their pigeons is happening in spite of the antibiotics. The pigeon is fighting the infection primarily on it's own. Furthermore, what is remarkable, is that to get antibiotics to treat humans, you need a prescription from the doctor.

You can't just buy them for yourself at the chemists. This is to limit their inappropriate and indiscriminate use. Similarly if you want antibiotics to treat your dog or cat you need firstly to have the pet examined by a vet. But access to antibiotics to treat pigeons seems to be under no such control.

Antibiotics can very easily be obtained within pigeon circles, usually from someone who buys them when they go abroad, where controls are less vigorously enforced. Even when fanciers obtain antibiotics legitimately, from a reputable vet, and follow the instructions to the letter, it can still turn out to be a complete waste of time and money.

Evidence? In Holland, at the University of Utrecht, all the antibiotics sold for treating pigeons were evaluated, and the doses recommended by the manufacturer were compared with their effectiveness at killing bacterial infections. They found that only 3 of the recommended dosages out of 60 formulations marketed were correct.

It was concluded that the majority of treatments are unlikely to work. The reason for this is that the so-called pigeon antibiotics were never developed for pigeons. They were first developed for humans, then adapted for farm animals like pigs and chickens, and for common pets like cats and dogs.

Few, if any, trials have been carried out on pigeons. It's no wonder the manufacturers have to guess the dose. The antibiotics are not even administered on an individual basis to the pigeons. Fanciers just throw some powder into the drinkers.

So how much is each pigeon getting? How much will the pigeon absorb? Will it achieve blood levels high enough to kill the bacteria? Will the pigeon's metabolism break down the antibiotic and excrete it before it can work? If you give too much is it toxic?

None of these questions have been answered. The Dutch study concluded that if all the antimicrobials sold for treating pigeons had to be registered under the Dutch medicines act 1985 they would nearly all be rejected because of poor pharmacokinetics and bacteriological efficacy.

To make things worse, fanciers are even giving antibiotics when there are no symptoms, just in case! So what, you might ask, it can't do any harm........can it? It most certainly can! The indiscriminate use of antibiotics is about to cause the biggest disaster that has hit the pigeon world.......ever.

Let me explain to the irresponsible scribes in the fancy press that keep extolling the virtues of antibiotics, and I include all the qualified vets in that category......if we don't stop using antibiotics a new killer superbug will evolve. A bug so resistant that it will chomp up any antibiotic that we throw at it.

All life on two legs will become plagued by untreatable life threatening bacterial infection, and that includes the pigeon fancier as well. Scare mongering? I think not. I'm not the only one who is thinking along these lines. Let me tell you a story.

In America the Federal Drug Agency has banned the use of antibiotics by American poultry farmers. The reason.........new antibiotic resistant bacteria are springing up that cause untreatable gastric illness in chickens........and yes, in humans. But that's only just a one off isn't it.............wrong! In hospitals, doctors and nurses are at the moment fighting an uphill battle.

The cause is MRSA Methicillin-resistant Staphlococcus Aureus. If a patient coming out of an operation gets the bug it can dramatically reduce their chances of survival. Patients are dying, not because of their illness or surgery, but because of septicaemia.

All patients being moved between hospitals have to be screened for this potentially deadly bacteria, and if someone is carrying it, they go straight into isolation, because once this bug gets out into the ward there is very little out there to kill it. It is resistant to nearly all known antibiotics.

It's rapidly becoming untreatable! Furthermore, two million people a year die of Tuberculosis, one new person per second is contracting the disease. But that's not a problem in Britain is it........? Yes I'm afraid so. 70-100 people entering Heathrow airport a year are detected as having TB.

They are X-rayed and given treatment to prevent the spread into the large cities like London, but people still slip through. In America they are taking the threat of a TB epidemic very seriously. In 1997 in New York they spent 1 billion dollars to try to control the spread of the disease.

But TB is easy to clear up.....isn't it? Wrong!.....a person with TB has to take 6-7 antibiotics per day for SIX months to be sure of recovery. Why so many antibiotics, for so long? TB has evolved to become resistant.

It is now known as Multi drug-resistant Tuberculosis......MDRTB, and because of that, many classes of antibiotics have to be taken to make sure that that the sufferers are using at least one antibiotic that's effective. However the list of effective antibiotics that can be used to fight TB is getting shorter.

The reason? Over-prescribing and over-use of antibiotics. In the past doctors were so keen to give out antibiotics they treated them like sweets. If you went to the doctor with a cold you were given......antibiotics. If you went there with a cough you were given.....antibiotics.

Sure they killed some bugs but the bacteria that were resistant were left untouched, and suddenly with all the other bacteria out of the way they didn't have any competition. They multiplied and filled the spaces left by the good bugs.

Does this scenario sound familiar to anyone. Read any of the pigeon journals. There is always some scribe telling everyone to use antibiotics for something. One of them proclaimed that as soon as his pigeons looked a bit off, he'd give them antibiotics. Well if he sticks to that regime soon his pigeons will look more than just a bit off.....their droppings will be liquid, they will be throwing up, losing weight and falling over......dead.

He is creating just the right conditions for Antibiotic-Resistant Salmonellosis......ARS......and he is one, because if such a bug gets out and invades the poultry industry we will have to kill all our pigeons. Surely the Ministry of agriculture fisheries and foods (MAFF) wouldn't make us do that would they?

All I can say to that is BSE........over 100,000 cattle slaughtered to prevent the spread of the disease. Porcine swine fever.........tens of thousands of pigs killed to contain the infection. In the sixties Foot and mouth disease.........212,000 cattle, 108,000 sheep and 114,000 pigs slaughtered, need I go on.
The MAFF are unlikely to risk the destruction of the billion pound poultry industry, so that a few people can race pigeons. Remember, it was the MAFF that proclaimed paramyxovirus a notifiable disease in pigeons, and instigated compulsory vaccination to prevent the spread to poultry farms. So they have the power.
So, is the appearance and spread of a superbug just fantasy? Well, let us just look around. In the 1940's penecillin could easily destroy the bacteria that causes meningitis, well today, in the United States, due to over prescribing, three quarters of the meningitis causing bacteria are resistant to it. Now outbreaks of meningitis have never been so high.

In Greece where antibiotics are available over the counter over half of all the bacteria in circulation are resistant to treatment. In the bird world, in Kenya where antibiotics are added to chicken feed, chicken guts now are full of bacteria totally resistant to tetracycline.

Exactly how serious is the situation? Well, in Madagascar a single strain of plague bacillus is now resistant to ampicillin, chloramphenicol, streptomycin, kanamycin, tetracycline,and the sulphonamides. Yes I'll repeat that.....PLAGUE. We are not talking acne here......this is plague. If that gets out we are in real trouble.

More frighteningly, once the superbugs move in there is no shifting them, you're stuck with them for life. Evidence? In Norway a broiler farm was hit by Vancomycin-resistant Enterococci, VRE, due to the use of antibiotics in the feed. They killed all the chickens, stripped down the whole place, scrubbed it out completely with bleach and germicides.

They put in new stock from a clean hatchery and within three weeks all the new chickens had VRE. It only takes the ingestion of one resistant bacteria and before long there are millions of them. There are over one million bacteria in the guts of a pigeon.

There are about two million pigeons in Britain. That's two billion bacteria.......luckily most of them friendly. But if pigeon fanciers keep using antibiotics, they will wipe out all the friendly bacteria, and guess what will move into their place.......the antibiotic resistant ones....the killers.

So if you get an antibiotic resistant strain in your loft, you will probably never be able to race again. You will have to kill all of your birds in the loft assuming they haven't died already, burn down the loft, and move. Even that will only work if you are not a carrier.

Perhaps you don't use antibiotics. Well don't think that because of that you are safe. If someone down your club does use them, and his pigeons carry an antibiotic resistant strain of bacteria, and your pigeons go into the same race crate, they will share the same drinker, stand in the same droppings, and eat the same food off of the floor during a holdover.

The process of infestation by an antibiotic-resistant strain of bacteria can be very rapid as the entire bacterial population in the guts of a pigeon can be completely replaced in as little as 20 minutes.

So what is the solution. Stop using antibiotics, stop reading articles proclaiming the use of antibiotics, tell your mates to stop using them, stop buying antibiotics, and don't let your vet give you any antibiotics, get rid of any pigeons that are persistently sick and let your loft build up it's own natural immunity. Only then, will pigeon racing, and probably mankind, have a safer future.

Naaa!.....I hear you say.......this is all in the future it won't bother us now. Well just open up your pigeon paper and see the new 'service' that is being offered by the vets...........antibiotic-sensitivity testing!........The bacteria found in pigeon droppings have started to become antibiotic-resistant! So watch out pigeons.......the superbugs are on their way!

just opinions mate not saying they wrong or right lol sean

I'm sorry Sean, but I will argue with you to the cows come home. Do you know who these guys are. They aint some crackpots. These are two of the most respected vets in the fancy.

Gary Burgess wrote:

I'm sorry Sean, but I will argue with you to the cows come home. Do you know who these guys are. They aint some crackpots. These are two of the most respected vets in the fancy.

but it dont say they right many been wrong before and will be in the future history tells you that lol sean

Circo virus and there are other viruses emerging. Look at humans. MRSA, they are using natural antibiotics such as Manuka honey. Because it's natural they never will become immune to it.
Circo virus is not what kills your birds it's the secondary infections.
Believe me it's true mate.

Gary Burgess wrote:

Circo virus and there are other viruses emerging. Look at humans. MRSA, they are using natural antibiotics such as Manuka honey. Because it's natural they never will become immune to it.
Circo virus is not what kills your birds it's the secondary infections.
Believe me it's true mate.

BUT MATE THATS ALL THEORYS NOT PROVEN FACTS SO WHO REALLY KNOWS

They are proven facts Sean ARE YOU STUPID Do you know what a Tetracycline Antibiotic is.
Why anyone would want to give antibiotics to a pigeon without it showing any signs of illness is beyond me.
Your as daft as he is mate. Of course it's proven.
Like I always say mate a little knowledge

ANY NEW START STARTERS - I URGE YOU DO NOT LISTEN TO THIS MAN.

Gary Burgess wrote:

They are proven facts Sean ARE YOU STUPID Do you know what a Tetracycline Antibiotic is.
Why anyone would want to give antibiotics to a pigeon without it showing any signs of illness is beyond me.
Your as daft as he is mate. Of course it's proven.
Like I always say mate a little knowledge

ANY NEW START STARTERS - I URGE YOU DO NOT LISTEN TO THIS MAN.

GARY I PUT THIS ON OUT OF INTEREST THIS SYSTEM IS AS I STATED JIM EMERTONS IF YOU EVER WIN A TENTH OF WHAT HE ACHIVED YOU MIGHT BE A GOOD FANCIER I MY SELF WOULD NOT USE ANY KIND OF ANTIBIOTICS UNLESS I WAS ADVISED TO IF MY BIRDS WHERE ILL YOU ARE A VERY DISRESPECTFUL PERSON AND KNOW VERY LITTLE ABOUT PIGEONS THATS MY OPINION OF YOU AND MANY OF YOUR POST PROVE THIS
END OF SEAN

Sorry mate. Once again you are so far off the mark. I quote from experience not from books. That's all I have to say on the matter.
You entitled to your opinion of course this is a public forum.
I aint going to get into a sort petty argument with the likes of you.
Disrespectful, maybe.

Gary Burgess wrote:

Sorry mate. Once again you are so far off the mark. I quote from experience not from books. That's all I have to say on the matter.
You entitled to your opinion of course this is a public forum.
I aint going to get into a sort petty argument with the likes of you.
Disrespectful, maybe.

WHAT DO YOU MEAN WITH THE LIKES OF ME ? YES AND VERY DISRESPECTFUL THATS FOR SURE
SO BY YOUR LAST POST YOU HAVE IN THE PAST DABLED IN ANTIBIOTICS
AND I WONT GET INTO ANY PETTY ARGUEMENTS WITH YOU AS YOU HAVE TOTTALLY MISSED THE POINT
AND I DONT THINK YOU CAN TEACH ME ANY THING YOUR 10 YEARS BEHIND THE TIMES RED CELL ITS A JOKE ALL THE BEST SEAN

seanl wrote:

Gary Burgess wrote:

I know about antibiotic abuse and it's implications. Creatine and antibiotics a great combination mate, why not chuck a bit of Acetyl l-carnitine in there as well just for a good measure.
I know better than to dose my birds with antibiotics, do you know they do to your birds immune system. Have you ever come across the term antibiotic resistant bacteria. This comes from the over use of antibiotics.
That's my opinion.

its not my system its taken from jim emmertons writings but i will tell you one thing i once asked a doctor he said if you could get imune which he stated you cant it would take over 10 years lol and your entittled to your opinion mate cheers sean lol

Sean.what the hell are you talking about .you make no sense mate.

GRIZZLECOCK wrote:

seanl wrote:

Gary Burgess wrote:

I know about antibiotic abuse and it's implications. Creatine and antibiotics a great combination mate, why not chuck a bit of Acetyl l-carnitine in there as well just for a good measure.
I know better than to dose my birds with antibiotics, do you know they do to your birds immune system. Have you ever come across the term antibiotic resistant bacteria. This comes from the over use of antibiotics.
That's my opinion.

its not my system its taken from jim emmertons writings but i will tell you one thing i once asked a doctor he said if you could get imune which he stated you cant it would take over 10 years lol and your entittled to your opinion mate cheers sean lol

Sean.what the hell are you talking about .you make no sense mate.

i was told that by a doctor fact one day you might post something positive on this site instead of all your negative responces

all i will say about this topic is antibioctics are over used to much by the fancy
if you want to use them then go ahead use them .
but i wount touch them with a barge poll , sean you say where behind the times with regards to treatment
if you have to use pills and potions to keep pigeons healthy then i feel very sorry for them ive had a life time in pigeons i know what it takes to keep them fit and healthy and you can see by the pics i put on the other week how my birds look the in top nick , as they should be this time of year .
people pair up to early they don,t give there birds enough time to recover from racing and the moult
no sooner have they moulted then there pairing up at xmas time then there treating for this that and the other
with not enough time between courses , and now fanciers are injecting for para 2x a year my mind boggles at such treatment you mess with mother nature and she as a habbit of biting back big time and it will believe me
it will and i wont feel sorry for these fanciers one bit they deserve what they get .

kev d wrote:

all i will say about this topic is antibioctics are over used to much by the fancy
if you want to use them then go ahead use them .
but i wount touch them with a barge poll , sean you say where behind the times with regards to treatment
if you have to use pills and potions to keep pigeons healthy then i feel very sorry for them ive had a life time in pigeons i know what it takes to keep them fit and healthy and you can see by the pics i put on the other week how my birds look the in top nick , as they should be this time of year .
people pair up to early they don,t give there birds enough time to recover from racing and the moult
no sooner have they moulted then there pairing up at xmas time then there treating for this that and the other
with not enough time between courses , and now fanciers are injecting for para 2x a year my mind boggles at such treatment you mess with mother nature and she as a habbit of biting back big time and it will believe me
it will and i wont feel sorry for these fanciers one bit they deserve what they get .

correct kev but as i said i posted the guys system never at any time did i say i would use for useing sake but would if my birds where ill and had been prescribed after testing yes plenty do each to their own sean

yes i know you only took it from else where mate as you say each to there own

seanl wrote:

kev d wrote:

all i will say about this topic is antibioctics are over used to much by the fancy
if you want to use them then go ahead use them .
but i wount touch them with a barge poll , sean you say where behind the times with regards to treatment
if you have to use pills and potions to keep pigeons healthy then i feel very sorry for them ive had a life time in pigeons i know what it takes to keep them fit and healthy and you can see by the pics i put on the other week how my birds look the in top nick , as they should be this time of year .
people pair up to early they don,t give there birds enough time to recover from racing and the moult
no sooner have they moulted then there pairing up at xmas time then there treating for this that and the other
with not enough time between courses , and now fanciers are injecting for para 2x a year my mind boggles at such treatment you mess with mother nature and she as a habbit of biting back big time and it will believe me
it will and i wont feel sorry for these fanciers one bit they deserve what they get .

correct kev but as i said i posted the guys system never at any time did i say i would use for useing sake but would if my birds where ill and had been prescribed after testing yes plenty do each to their own sean

must agree the amount of treatments i hear people giving for this and that is beyond me you cant keep it up and expect to get away with it and ide say 90% dont even know what they are treating for without them being tested why give things for something they may not have i hear people treat for canker every 3 weeks please tell me how you expect them to get any sort of inmunity
and where your rest program is in between but as you say each to there own
we can go on for ever but 1 things for sure your birds wont if you keep traeting them

in september 2010 i heard of a fancier in my fed doing very well with the young uns and it turned out he was packing in, anyway i studied the club and fed results and 2 of the birds stood out a country mile winning 6 of the 9 races between then in the club with between2-300b per week.

i managed to buy the pair of them but took the hen blind without seeing her the cock is stunning the hen pretty horrible and after doing some digging it turns out the hens were put on anti-biotics an notably baytril to give them a boost for racing as the hens were never raced after yb stage wheras the cocks were treated carefully as they were the future of the loft.

i have perserved with the hen and not bred from her, treated her with anything other than the normal natural products and finally she looks stunning whn she is put under stress again i dont know how she will react but 15 months it has taken to get her acceptable and 15 months of willpower to stop me culling her.

convinced this is down to the sh**e put into her, and ps the cock without the crap put into him as a young un was the higher winner out the 2 which puts the seller of the birds theory to bed imo

like i say you wont get away with it the birds wont last and thats why so many are for sale its there shit they know wont do anything in later life
glad you got the bird right best of luck