old familys v the new

Gaz b wrote:

right again Don, and thats is one thing that both Kev and I can boast, our birds have a fantastic immune system as very little medication is ever used, except of course the pmv vaccine. but thats about it.

Spot on Gaz just look at the money which you are saving plus you never get bad pigeons and the ones that are are weak anyway

Put me right as i know nothing

Spencer has hit the nail on the head with one comment, and its something that repeats through history in pigeons. Its one thing getting birds from top lofts and breeding a good bird or even buying a good bird but as Spencer says keeping it is another thing.

I have read so many times that this fancier or that fancier bought pigeons and for a short period of time raced like no other winning everything, then they go back to the well and get some more, however it can come to an end, and quickly.
Im a believer that even 1 really good pigeon can make you a name, but once its gone so is sucess, but if you can keep breeding them you will always have good pigeons.

Braspenning is one which springs to mind he bought janssens from the source and became a champion, once he sold out he realized what hed lost, he still races well but not like before.
Albert babbington with the van den boushe was the same bought from wouters and meulemans and broke records but if you read his book he kept going back, with the birds he already had he neednt have gone anywhere. When they were gone so was he.

Rudderfett wrote:

Spencer has hit the nail on the head with one comment, and its something that repeats through history in pigeons. Its one thing getting birds from top lofts and breeding a good bird or even buying a good bird but as Spencer says keeping it is another thing.

I have read so many times that this fancier or that fancier bought pigeons and for a short period of time raced like no other winning everything, then they go back to the well and get some more, however it can come to an end, and quickly.
Im a believer that even 1 really good pigeon can make you a name, but once its gone so is sucess, but if you can keep breeding them you will always have good pigeons.

Braspenning is one which springs to mind he bought janssens from the source and became a champion, once he sold out he realized what hed lost, he still races well but not like before.
Albert babbington with the van den boushe was the same bought from wouters and meulemans and broke records but if you read his book he kept going back, with the birds he already had he neednt have gone anywhere. When they were gone so was he.

Spot on Martyn for me if i ever come as good as Albert (one big wish) yes he went back but for me once you have the right pigeons and this only my opinion as i know nothing it would be best to add new pigoens every 2/3 years new blood to keep the blood running with good genes rather than fadding after 10 years never to return
JMO Mate

This debate has been going on over here also ;Has stated all birds must come from some where ? ;the main problem is most fanciers ;chop & change all the time ;the most up to date winning pigeons come from crossings etc ;but how many bad ones do we breed to get that champion ?;same with the Dogs & Horsers ?its only the good one's we all talk about ?; I believe the Secret ;if any is to maintain your winning birds & have a cross in your own loft that will hit ; Pigeons have got faster & faster in my life time ;but i believe they have lost or are losing there distance Gene ?;look at the lossers we have now ? we have an old Family here since 1961 which we could win from start to finish with but not for the last 20 odd years ?; we get maybe 2 racers a year that suits them now; but when the going gets tough ;i know what i'm clocking;mosts of the hype is salesmanship ;we have been all buying Belgium best for 150 plus years ?how come they still have the best? one Dutch fancier hit the nail on the head when he said ;kill the bad ones sell the good ones & keep the Supers ?something to think about ? cheers

Killer that is a good post fair play mate

"one Dutch fancier hit the nail on the head when he said ;kill the bad ones sell the good ones & keep the Supers " ?something to think about ? cheers

think i remember reading this, was it bert braspenning who said it killer...?


interesting topic, and some very good posts.

personaly i prefer the old familys, as these have been tried and tested they will certanly face the channel and the terrain up into sec K not to mention the english weather, and you can be certain of a next day bird when the going has been tough, i feel that the continental birds are more of a fair weather bird, and dont have the tenasity to stick at it when the going gets tough ? .

David
his first name is Ad ;but its been going on for age's ;i agree i love the old stuff too Edgie ;but the Sprint birds have taken over ;has most of the racers are Sprint to Medium Distance ;so the 3 or 4 over 400 miles plus;don't warrant the older type birds & adleast 2 of them we will clock the faster pigeons anyway ;but we lose more birds now than ever ? cheers

Bang on the nail once again killer, I like his other statement.
A Free Pigeon With Every Pedigree Purchased. LOL

Even the old families of pigeons can still hold their own in todays competition, but they have to be experimented with.
Crossing is the way forward, but it takes years of experimental breeding to get it right.
But in todays world you cant afford to sit still.

I think the other problem is most fanciers chop & change to much & don't give pigeons time :by this they don't tend to keep there own familys long enough to work them out ?also most havent got the knowledge to line breed & know when an outcross is needed ?you can also be too silly not to bring in the right bird ? thats why i prefer to have the out cross in our own lofts ;knowing our chancers will be greater ? this you can only do by years of trial & error;cheers

Many roads lead to Rome and a good racer is never always a good breeder and visa versa but retaining it's nestmate gives you even better odds in the breeding shed.

Now we are starting to get it for sure, I do think if you have a good family racing yourself then buying good birds to blend in works, but you must destroy the ones that dont add to the colony.

David wrote:

"one Dutch fancier hit the nail on the head when he said ;kill the bad ones sell the good ones & keep the Supers " ?something to think about ? cheers

think i remember reading this, was it bert braspenning who said it killer...?


interesting topic, and some very good posts.

it was ad shalekens on his dvd david he said he wanted super pigeons not good pigeons sean

This is like something we were discussing a while ago about the 3 generations.
I have a thing about the nest mates of winners as kev would tell ya, I have been to lofts to buy birds and they show us all their winners, then i ask do you have any that haven't won.
7 times out of 10, they are the breeders.
We stick with this theory as it has worked well for us this one reason why we very rarely sell a pair of nest mates.
We always retain one.

If I get rid of the good ones and keep the top ones I would have an empty loft..

wouldnt we all, we only have a hand full of top ones

more than a handfull is a waste..

lol but what waste

seanl wrote:

Gaz b wrote:

Many roads lead to Rome and a good racer is never always a good breeder and visa versa but retaining it's nestmate gives you even better odds in the breeding shed.

very true Gaz but i have found that by buying the children off the champs can some times give you a very good breeder as mostly these champs dont breed good racers
but often their gchildren come up trumps sean

Spot on Seanl

Gaz b wrote:

This is like something we were discussing a while ago about the 3 generations.
I have a thing about the nest mates of winners as kev would tell ya, I have been to lofts to buy birds and they show us all their winners, then i ask do you have any that haven't won.
7 times out of 10, they are the breeders.
We stick with this theory as it has worked well for us this one reason why we very rarely sell a pair of nest mates.
We always retain one.

Quality Gaz