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Oldstrain/Darren`s Winner of winners. 2012.
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The N.E.H.U race from Melton Mowbray 21/4/2012 was won by Peel bros of South Shields, they took 1st club 1st fed, also taking 2nd and 4th club and 15 of the 25 birds clocked in the club......well done Peel brothers.
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 the use of bleach

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MISTY
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PostSubject: Re: the use of bleach   Sun May 20, 2018 10:05 am

It is how you win that matter.
I always use the car as a good example.
You have two fanciers with identical cars and a manual that tells you the best possible means of getting the best out of them regarding fuel etc, without causing damage to the car.

One decides that using a high octane fuel would give a clear advantage and does so and wins a couple of races but also ruins the engine, but hey, you can sell the car you have ruined based on ill gotten wins and buy anothercar to ruin.

Regards.



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Knackered
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PostSubject: Re: the use of bleach   Mon May 21, 2018 1:21 am

MISTY wrote:
It is how you win that matter.
I always use the car as a good example.
You have two fanciers with identical cars and a manual that tells you the best possible means of getting the best out of them regarding fuel etc, without causing damage to the car.

One decides that using a high octane fuel would give a clear  advantage and does so and wins a couple of races but also ruins the engine, but hey, you can sell the car you have ruined based on ill gotten wins and buy anothercar to ruin.

Regards.

 

Interesting proposition etc Misty Smile Smile I take it you have never tried Milton also Wink Wink. Bleach may appear cheap & nasty as such Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes & also harmful, but I would suggest not be to judge mental Smile Smile or one day here lol! lol! lol! I may just tell you, how many pigeons I have had fly 600 odd miles here bounce bounce with bleach in their water Wink Wink & truth be told, I don't talk in small, small
numbers Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes when I speak my waffle  Smile  Smile. cheers
*****
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MISTY
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PostSubject: Re: the use of bleach   Mon May 21, 2018 2:26 pm

Knackered,

Many fanciers used Milton tablets to supposedly disinfect the drinkers, it was used by parents to do the same to feeding bottles etc;

I never used anything whatsoever to clean the drinkers and they were very rarely emptied just topped up and new garlic added the proof of the pudding being my pigeons never had all the problems many other fanciers were and are having health wise and I lost very few pigeons.

Having looked up the scientific recommendations regarding bleach in all instances it says it should not be given to animals.

As have said many times over the years, you can make a bear dance but look at how those involved achieve it.

I would not have been interested in the sport if I had to use widowhood or the darkness systems along with clinical conditions more suitable to an isolation hospital.

I got as much pleasure watching the pigeons having the time of their life, free and doing what they enjoyed, but I think it depends entirely on what your agenda is.

There is no better motive than the love of their home, you can use artificial means but you get artificial pigeons.

Regars.

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David
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PostSubject: Re: the use of bleach   Mon May 21, 2018 7:04 pm

Milton tablets were for steralizing a babys bottle, which had to be well washed out afterwards........miltons wasn't meant for the child to drink No No No
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PostSubject: Re: the use of bleach   Tue May 22, 2018 6:42 am

David wrote:
Milton tablets were for steralizing a babys bottle, which had to be well washed out afterwards........miltons wasn't meant for the child to drink No No No
No No No Smile Smile Maybe for you David Wink Wink but from my perspective, Milton is just one Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes of a long list of additives I would suggest that have been used over the years etc by many flyers with good & maybe at times a bad outcome etc. Truth be told bounce bounce I'm affraid I've used many of them type of thing when on my learning curve here & the one thing I will say is, if most are used in a sensible type manner you should still finish up many old age pensioners in your loft like I have over the years. cheers
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MISTY
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PostSubject: Re: the use of bleach   Tue May 22, 2018 7:04 am

Knackered,

There are many roads to Rome , it would be interesting to know just exactly how you used the products.

Regards.
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barnie
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PostSubject: Re: the use of bleach   Tue May 22, 2018 8:37 am

I do understand why some fanciers may be tempted to use certain disinfecting products in the drinking water. I'm sure some do this successfully without harming livestock because of the minute quantity once its diluted, but the big problem is pigeon fanciers being how they are, hear about "new stuff" someone is using and winning. If the correct dosage is 5ml per gallon then you can bet joe bloggs chucks in 10ml to get a bit more junk into them thinking it will do the birds twice as good. That's the nature of pigeon men (not all but quite a lot).
Putting too much basic multivits in drinkers then there's every chance birds will pass it out their body naturally but too much stuff like bleach then you'll poison the poor things.
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MISTY
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PostSubject: Re: the use of bleach   Tue May 22, 2018 10:08 am

barnie.
A lot depends on how desperate you are to WIN.

Too many fanciers give little or no regard to the pigeons feelings and use them like Robots.

Regards.
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oldstrain
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PostSubject: Re: the use of bleach   Tue May 22, 2018 10:33 am

barnie wrote:
I do understand why some fanciers may be tempted to use certain disinfecting products in the drinking water. I'm sure some do this successfully without harming livestock because of the minute quantity once its diluted, but the big problem is pigeon fanciers being how they are, hear about "new stuff" someone is using and winning. If the correct dosage is 5ml per gallon then you can bet joe bloggs chucks in 10ml to get a bit more junk into them thinking it will do the birds twice as good. That's the nature of pigeon men (not all but quite a lot).
Putting too much basic multivits in drinkers then there's every chance birds will pass it out their body naturally but too much stuff like bleach then you'll poison the poor things.

aint that a fact regarding fanciers thinking twice as much will be twice better Laughing
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PostSubject: Re: the use of bleach   Tue May 22, 2018 11:33 am

oldstrain wrote:
barnie wrote:
I do understand why some fanciers may be tempted to use certain disinfecting products in the drinking water. I'm sure some do this successfully without harming livestock because of the minute quantity once its diluted, but the big problem is pigeon fanciers being how they are, hear about "new stuff" someone is using and winning. If the correct dosage is 5ml per gallon then you can bet joe bloggs chucks in 10ml to get a bit more junk into them thinking it will do the birds twice as good. That's the nature of pigeon men (not all but quite a lot).
Putting too much basic multivits in drinkers then there's every chance birds will pass it out their body naturally but too much stuff like bleach then you'll poison the poor things.

aint that a fact regarding fanciers thinking twice as much will be twice better Laughing
lol! lol! lol! We are only Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes but pigeon men O/S Wink Wink & on average I suggest lol! lol! lol! at times I'm affraid not the brightest bunch Smile Smile around, when it comes to making decisions as such Smile Smile. cheers
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PostSubject: Re: the use of bleach   Tue May 22, 2018 9:17 pm

For many years I have said that using clinical methods relative to the our sport would result in the deterioration of the pigeons health and immune system, this firstly in the early 1970s.

Today on the television the scientists have come to the same conclusion regarding humans.

Children should be allowed to wallow in the mud etc;

I have had the same opinion regarding our feathered friends, mine had access to the garden and anywhere else they decided to venture all daylight hours and were naturally healthy not needing either curative or preventative rubbish.

The vast majority of pigeons today if allowed to do the same would not survive the majority treated for both preventative and curative on a flock system and the fanciers have no idea which are naturally healthy and which are propped up and they wonder why they lose the majority every year.

The sooner they get back to nature and basics the better for all concerned, the pigeons health and the fanciers pocket.


Regards.

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PostSubject: Re: the use of bleach   Wed May 23, 2018 1:30 am

Yes. Have managed hog barns were I produced many thousand of pigs a year. My son still does. At that time I treated the pigeons as livestock. Vaccinations, preventatives, etc,. With hogs or poultry or whatever it is not economic to change anything. Profits go down. Quit the treatments 10 years ago. Pigeons. "What if?" scenario. Dedicated now to no meds or vaccines.
Had my share of dirt, hunger, living in a 2 up 2 down in West Hartlepool and since. But hey! I am OK! Ummm.. must be the heart pills stopping the Viagra working...meds..which to take or ignore...
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