Darkness system ...?

went to club meeting this morning and one of the members said the 1st of april is the deadline for putting ybs on it...after that it wont work right....any opinions ?

I have never herd that but mine started on the 1st I am trying a it  different way this year I am dark at 4 oclock till it gets dark a then I open them up, as I thought that 4 till 9 next morning was to long with out good fresh air so I thought 4 till dark seem about wright got to try something to make things easy and the birds get fresh air and see which way the sun comes up
      

HI .BEEN TOLD YOU SHOULD DARKEN FROM ABOUT 5 AT NIGHT TILL 7 IN THE MORNING I TAKE IT THE YOUNGSTERS ON THE DARKNESS WILL BE ON ONE FEED PER DAY? AT THE MOMENT OUR BIRDS HAVE FOOD IN FRONT OF THEM ALL DAY. DOES IT MATTER WHEN YOU PUT THEM ON THE DARKNESS ? OURS HAVE ONLY BEEN OVER ONE WEEK IF YOU DARKEN NOW THEY WILL BE SHORT OF CORN??CHEERS TERRYP...

David wrote:

went to club meeting this morning and one of the members said the 1st of april is the deadline for putting ybs on it...after that it wont work right....any opinions ?

My opinion is,do not belive 1 word a fellow club member says.....sad but true...if he can put you on the wrong path...he has you beaten...
From the Heart... best regards

Ginger wrote:

I have never herd that but mine started on the 1st I am trying a it  different way this year I am dark at 4 oclock till it gets dark a then I open them up, as I thought that 4 till 9 next morning was to long with out good fresh air so I thought 4 till dark seem about wright got to try something to make things easy and the birds get fresh air and see which way the sun comes up
      

hi ginger, im thinking of doing the same method myself....darkening at 4 o clock then opening up later when its dark.....then they will get the natural day break the next morning.

done it before from 5 till 9, so might as well try something else to see what happens.   

terryp wrote:

HI .BEEN TOLD YOU SHOULD DARKEN FROM ABOUT 5 AT NIGHT  TILL 7 IN THE MORNING I TAKE IT  THE YOUNGSTERS ON THE DARKNESS WILL BE ON ONE FEED PER DAY? AT THE MOMENT OUR BIRDS HAVE FOOD IN FRONT OF THEM ALL DAY. DOES IT MATTER WHEN YOU PUT THEM ON THE DARKNESS ? OURS HAVE ONLY BEEN OVER ONE WEEK IF YOU DARKEN NOW THEY WILL BE SHORT OF CORN??CHEERS TERRYP...

yes terry, once ive had them weaned for a week or so and see that they are eating and drinking ok, then I usually feed only once a day, and exercise once a day until they start to go training.....

GRIZZLECOCK wrote:

David wrote:

went to club meeting this morning and one of the members said the 1st of april is the deadline for putting ybs on it...after that it wont work right....any opinions ?

    My opinion is,do not belive 1 word a fellow club member says.....sad but true...if he can put you on the wrong path...he has you beaten...
               From the Heart... best regards

yes grizzle, im in full agreement with you there.......I usually take no notice of club members but the man who said it is one of the top flyers in the club, this is why I thought I would double check........either way, top flyer or not, cant see myself taking any notice of their "advice"....    

Many use it here. Has worked well for them for years. However the light system fanciers can more than hold their own. June 15 th add the light for another hour and so on.

heard of the light system hal, but to me it seems a lot of work compared to the dark system.....one of our site members has done last year I think, but he said never again the dark is better.

maybe if he comes on he will give his thoughts   

I have used darkness off and on mostly on for the last few years and I personally hate it and wont be on it this year.

I have found it doesn't matter when you start but it needs a certain amount of time to get going, and that chap down the club is probably basing this on time, as you might not have enough time to get them into a good moult then take them off ready to train in time for racing.

One thing I have found with it, is that once they have been on it a few months and the moult is well underway, then even if they are say only half finished the body if they then come off it, they will still hold the flights.
I found this out by mistake as I have had a natural section with ybs in as well as the darkness, every year the odd bird will pair to a natural or just decide it prefers it in there and comes off darkness really early, but it makes no difference, although the moult then stops they hold the flights as darkness.

I would say you still have time to go on if you start now.

thanks martyn, ive put mine on it other years after 1st april and they look to have moulted the head and body ...and not dropped any wing flights until well after the last yb race.....im thinking of using the same method as mufc rick this season which is closing down at 4 o clock, then opening up later that evening so they get a natural dawn/sunrise the day after......any thoughts ?

ill get mine through a full body moult in 9 to 10 wks plenty of conditioner seems to heat the body up and they go into a frenzy of a moult lol and as martyn says if only on for ex amount of wks will will only do part body moult but will hold the wing some ov my later yb I put on dark last yr that won and prized well hadn't fully body moulted   

thanks for the info ste.........

David wrote:

heard of the light system hal, but to me it seems a lot of work compared to the dark system.....one of our site members has done last year I think, but he said never again the dark is better.

maybe if he comes on he will give his thoughts   

Not sure about the work load. Birds always have fresh air and a cheap timer regulates the lights.

yes that's true hal, but the way I look at it is the ybs on dark are on it for approx. 9 weeks (?) and by what I remember of the light system they are on it all season....I may be wrong tho ?

I do not know the exact procedure. Sorry. Usually I mate up at different times instead of all at once. Now all together. Same age but even so some will be slow moulting and some fast. years ago a friend who kept them on the dark system called me. said his birds were starting to drop flights with the last 3 weeks in the races go. Gave him a bottle of stuff I was using for little pigs to prevent swollen joints etc,. 3 drops to a gallon. It stopped the moult dead. He did come out on top that year. Here it is cheap and available at any location that sells feed, farm meds etc,. Now do not know if it is available in the UK but should be.

I have also noticed a few other things with the darkness apart from the fact that once the hormones are activated doesn't matter if they don't see it through fully they hold flights,, Also I have had birds that went astray for a while and came back, and birds gone into natural loft for weeks and then went back to darkness,,,and on both times they still hold flights.

But I also have had birds who were the other way around and moved from the natural loft into the darkness section and had started moulting wing flights about 2 or 3 but as they were then darkened for a few weeks, they stop moulting them and then hold the flights like full darkness birds.

But as I said I have now stopped racing darkness, there are many reasons but the biggest reason is the fact that I believe 100% that we all loose our best pigeons as youngsters, and If mine are in tip top condition I might be tempted to keep them going where in my brain should be telling me 2/3/or 4 races is all that's needed to set them up for next year.

I really don't care about yb racing its for fools to chaise the averages and race every race to the death and loose valuable pigeons that would be winners the following years.
Some of my best pigeons were lost or made mistakes as babies and went on to be really good racers.

If you want to win with ybs after 180 miles in the later races and you cannot resist sending to every race and want to chaise a pointless average trophy ...then darkness is a must but if like me you use the racing just to educate future champions and have a bit of fun along the way forget it, natural ybs will compete for the first 4 races easily.

Interesting post. I think some fanciers who swear by it and not at are very pleased with their results. Also as yearlings. Another friend I know raises over 120 young birds each year. Buys 200 bands. He did not race old birds to concentrate on his young birds. Asked him why? Said he wanted to dominate the Fed. So sent 60 each week. 30 to the long 30 to the short. Dark system. He did win the Fed once but nothing else spectacular. Have had young birds here clocked and he as asked me if I had any home. I have an hours overfly on him. Told him 3 or 4. Asked me how many I sent. told him 20 or so. Next question was "What are you putting in the water?" told him water. "You on the dark system?' "No, usual way." Mutter mutter on his end then he hung up. Volume may win some races. Many times does. But the fancier aforementioned buys all the expensive flavour of the month pigeon enhancer products. they want for nothing. It costs him a fortune. But each to their own. Quite a few years back, 15 or so he did win some big prize money. With youngsters bred from birds I had gave him. So he bought better birds and better products and got in to eye sign and all the tweaking stuff. He lives out in the country also. But his birds did not peck the ground or stuff like that. They were regimented. Fine in a city or town or a hawk laden area. No matter. Got all they wanted from expensive Belgium additives
Throw all the money at the birds as you can. Or keep it simple and enjoy the rewards. OOPS! Yapping too much again!.

Oh yes. stuff I gave the guy years back was called Predeff. Cortisone. Inhibits the protein so as feathers are protien it stops the moult.

I think you will find that product has been out lawed ?

Could be. not sure. I was using it on the pigs 4 years back. Then barn was closed down so again you could be right.

http://www.drugs.com/vet/predef-2x-sterile-aqueous-suspension-can.html
Still available here.

13 hours dark for 9 weeks is all that is required ...take um off slowly an extra hour of light 1/2 hour either end of yer hours for a week should do nicely but the darkness aint for me these days due to family commitments which is a blessing in disguise viewing my yearlings ...but good luck to the guys adopting the system

i,m not going on the dark again this season.if i get 5 to 6 races i,ll be happy ..i,ll see how these yearling perform this season then take it from there